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soulcircle
(3/30/04 10:20 am)
Reply 		Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
Hello Guests and All,

If we may in this thread we will have a calm discussion and do a lot of listening.
I will give an example.

In the thread in Householders versus Monastics, in the Topic " What happens to exmonastics why don't they open retreats," there were what appeared to be rather strong disagreements, but people were willing to listen and explain and calmness and Even gratitude was reached.

The lesson I learned in that thread was as moyma said, soulcircle must more often write in plain English, I had failed to do so.

OK, all?

Those that are determined that Yogananda is far beyond all grasp and are going to forever see him in white, as in the black and white version of reality, may not want to be in this thread.

Those that are in great pain and or angry---
well what is a little hard to say, is that those who think Yogananda had some flaw and should be seen in black as in the black or white with no grey areas, may not want to be in this thread.
~~~~~~~~~
Going back to the discussion in the "What happens to exmonastics and why don't they open retreats," I find the following necessary in this thread.

And please tell me if I am speaking plain English here.
Whatever the live that Yogananda lived, and whatever all around him experience, whether in recorded movie or rather agreed upon public life or in private moments,
whatever the truth is, I find Py.....

Quote:
I find Yogananda to be one of the best friends I have in this life and will ever have in any life.


In the thread under Core Issues, "To Soulcircle," my opinion of PY is represented as:
Quote:
as low an opinion of him as you do.


IN the "What happens to exmonastics why don't they open retreats," the confusion that cleared up when I spoke plain English was that it wasn't either or!!!!!!

We can live lives as "God First," yet at the same time to significant charity work (to transform myself more that actually change lives and the world), we can both be out serving and still live yoga and be IN God!

It's not either/or! and there had been confusion.

I don't feel that it is either we love PY or have a "low" opinion/hate him.
I don't feel it is either or.
OK?
I love him is whatever life he lived, not in any portrayal from second hand or a distance, but in his actual life, human and compassionate.

Another thing that is more important than I have been owning up to is evidence.

So I say ok to you seekerseeking, believe me I am listening, learning and growing. I see great qualities and love for truth and openess in you seekerseeking, and though I have written privately and you are concerned and right that that isn't open, I do have a solution!!

Ok seekerseeking, here we are for the world to witness and participate with us, and thank you for insisting that we take this healthy step.
I will openly approach eveidence!!

So in this thread let's take healthy kind steps.

And I will start with evidence that we can all have and work with and print word for word.

Evidence of a somewhat non-controversial nature, a small step before bigger steps with more evidence. Slow maybe, yet necessary, this is for ALL, perhaps for a couple centuries!

Before the evidence for this thread, I will quote another writer, and in his maturity we can all walk in kindness and listening, the benefits of which will be friendship and truth.

Below, I am paraphrasing what another writer has written, it certainly isn't word for word, I am shaping it to closely fit this post, etc.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~

You see I have for many many years wondered what we aren't being given of voice recordings of PY and then I heard that a tape of PY's talk on Patanjali exists, in this tape he also talks about other things, and the tone may be new to some folks. I have for more than twenty years, studied the writings and history of Yogananda. He was I believe, a unique spiritual personality. And the issue of whether or not, moments of humaness that some may see in a bad light, even if only one insignificant remark in questionable/bad taste, even if there were these moments they don't in my mind diminish his spirituality for me. I realized many years ago SRF could not be trusted. For some reason, they have felt the need to sanatize every detail of Yogananda's life and eliminate many of his human characteristcs from any public mention.
Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior. I have always desired to have the complete picture of Yogananda, or a complete as possible picture.
SRF may or may not have the tape of PY discussing Patanjali (and other topics). Whoever canl help ALL via this board in transcribing the tape here in a post, please consider doing so, or loaning me the tape. This type of evidence will be easy to accept for some people, before we look into other facets of this remarkable spiritual man's life, areas that will take a discussion and agreement of research direction and conduct and all kindness and as seekingseeker says, openess!
All efforts in this board have been met by SRF's silence or worse, negative reviews, i.e. telling people to stay away and villifying people who post.
I am not anti-SRF or pro SRF, nor am I fearful of what impact a public posting of the "Patanjali tape" might have on Yogananda's reputation. The truth is the highest good: it should be discovered and revealed for many reasons.
~~~~~~~
Again, I am paraphrasing at times, directly copying at times above what someone else wrote.

Now the evidence can be here in the open. Maybe soon.
Please, someone who has the tape referred to above, take your time, yet when you do have the time, please transcribe it here for all who visit this board.
Feel free to privately send me a message if you wish that I post it under my name. I presently don't have a copy of the tape. Thank you,
soulcircle

P.S. There have been more than 12,000 posts on this board, IF necessary I will add 1,000 more, to say I have a high opinion of PY, I do seekerseeking.

He is a unique spiritual personality and for me, nothing will diminsh the compassion I receive from him though the miracles his friendship brings to my life and perhaps to you.

P.P.S. I am busy with non-profit and charity and philanthrophy work, I have out-of-state family visiting and will gladly correct as many typos in this post as I can in a day or so

P.P.P.S.

More significant rummors could be brought in careful research and thoughtfulness, some of the rumor not generating evidence others genenrating it, yet if communication problems and passionate arguing arise, there might be a pointlessness.

With success and listening and an absense of name calling etc. we can go on from the "Patanjali tape" to more, maybe n ot, maybe.

P.P.P.P.S. In any case as seekerseeking suggests in the Core Issue thread "To soulcirlce," it is probably best for me shut up, and perhaps I will wait and listen and see how well people listen to the maturity of the writer whom I copied and parphrased above, the truthssearcher the one for whom like me, Yogananda is uniquely spiritual!

Used Yogi
New User
(4/2/04 1:00 am)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
People have implied here that when Yogananda first came to this country he slept with some women in New York and so a Ramakrishna Order monk (Nerode?) broke off contact with him or didn't like something else about his life. Then Nerode sued him for taking his name off The Science of Religion and won.

But most of it has been innuendo. Could someone elaborate? Give details and sources? Thanks!

Used Yogi
Registered User
(4/2/04 4:07 pm)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
Thanks didgeridootoo for mailing me to let me know about the Cult Busters ezboard. In the SRF section of Cult Busters, this was posted by Ek Balam. I haven't seen it here so I'm copying it. My apologies if someone already posted it to the SRF Walrus.

There is more at pub177.ezboard.com/fcultbusterssrfdivisionfrm7.showMessage?topicID=12.topic

==============================================

"Someone who was reading my posts, contacted me and said that he/she had taken information off Nerode’s website before SRF asked him to delete it all. He sent me a copy. Instead of printing it all, I will print what there is as to the sexual allegations:"

“My father and mother were married by Yogananda in 1941 in an elaborate pseudo ceremony Wedded by Yogananda on the palatial lawns of the Center on Mount Washington. This was filmed by Fox Movietone News and played on week in all the newsreels in all the movie houses in the country. It was also news in the great papers of India. The Bombay Chronicle, April 26, 1931. There were almost no Hindu-American marriages in that period, although they are common now. I say pseudo ceremony because the Asian Exclusion Act in force in California at the time prohibited marriages between Caucasians and East Indians. The existence of such exclusion laws seems almost unknown to present day America. I have had people deny that this could have been true in the twentieth century! We were not that much ahead of South Africa at that time. The binding ceremony was a civil marriage by a judge in Gallup, New Mexico, which had no such alien exclusion law. Announcement via Associated Press LA Times Wedding Announcement. A careful reading of the news clipping above shows that Yogananda staged and blessed the marriage of my parents as a union of East and West, which he explicitly states he had approved of in advance…

In January 1939 Yogananda and my father had a great falling out over a specific incident in Yogananda’s unending relationships with young women in the fellowship. He always had them living in quarters directly adjacent to his and away from everybody else’s. I remember these young women well, and still have group snapshots of them in the family archives, some of which I have included. But they would never remember a ubiquitous small person wandering the halls.

Yogananda liked to dress them in gauze-like material and exotic scents and nothing else, and with a recorded Indian musical accompaniment, have them strip and enter a perfumed bubble bath, after which he performed various supposedly traditional religious ceremonies. This was very Californian, but definitely not part of any Yoga tradition, and the foundation Yogis were scandalized. Yogis then were usually straitlaced Easterners, not liberal Westerners.

What is funny is the changing reaction to this story over the six decades that have passed since. In 1939 it was a scandal, in the 1960s the younger people thought that it was natural and appropriate that the spiritual and they were integrated, in the 1990’s it has been perceived as an abuse of power. People’s attitudes do change! As the senior Yogi there, my father spoke to Yogananda. He did not take to remonstrance from my father or any fellow Yogis. The impression was that he believed by this time that he was so annointed that, whatever his conduct; it had automatic approval by Divine Providence. To me, it sounded just like the Catholic Papa; indulgences, or the infallibility of the Pope in doctrinal matters.

The prospect of this aquatic initiation ceremony by the great man so terrified one eighteen year old that she asked my mother to ferry her home by car off the hill. There was no public transportation, and it was quite a hike. My mother did, and Yogananda was apoplectic. Sixty hears later my mother called on the woman’s family while visiting Los Angeles. They still expressed gratitude for the removal. The incident was the cause of my father’s split from Yogananda in January 1939. I am probably the only one alive under 90 who would attest by eyesight and ear to the truth of such stories about Yogananda. But who cares about the ancient memories of small children when they conflict with religious canon?

My father was a completely impractical and otherworldly Yogi. He had been told by Yogananda from the beginning that the whole Center was a partnership with him, so he sued to dissolve the partnership and recover $500,000 in assets so that he could found a new Yoga fellowship based on equality and without questionable practices. This suit made no sense whatsoever. He did not know what a partnership is a legal entity. The foundation was a non-profit corporation. There are not partners. Asking for a cash settlement made my father look venal, rather than principled, thought his conscious choice of a life as an itinerant Yogi refutes this.

Yogananda hired a famous and very expensive California criminal attorney anyway, A. Brigham Rose Rose and Allegations for the case, so he was certainly worried. My father’s lawyer put the source of the split, the allegations of sexual misconduct, into papers filed for the suit. If these papers had been held private, this would have constituted pressure to force Yogananda back onto a true path, since Yoganandsa would not want them made public in court. My father’s lawyer was so incompetent that the did not realize that court reporters routinely read all filed papers. They saw their chance for a scoop. The allegations of sexual misconduct with a bevy of very young girl disciples were front-page news in the Los Angeles papers "Dodging a Subpoena". My father confirmed the details when interviewed; having no other choice if he wanted to remain credible.

Yogananda concluded from the publicity that my father was out to destroy him, and the breach between Yogananda and my father changed the relation from brotherhood to lifelong animosity.

Yogananda now announced that it was against the rules of his “order” for Hindus to marry white women. So much for racial tolerance dirty chiseler. This, even though eight years earlier he said he gave prior approval and had married my parents himself in a Fox Movietone newsreel orchestrated by him and shown in all the movie theatres in the country! So much for principles.

That was the end of our connection with Yogananda. There was no one in the Center willing to corroborate for the Newspaper reporters either my father’s assertion of an oral partnership, or of the indiscretions. The young women involved did not want publicity. Many others needed to protect a comfortable life style threatened by public spectacle. The suit was summarily dismissed, and the scandal dropped out of the newspapers. Putting that stuff in papers available to the press was a lawyer’s mistake, not an attempt to destroy the Center. The sexual misconduct was irrelevant to the case at hand.

Sexual misconduct would have been relevant if the courts had been asked to remove Yogananda as unfit to run a non-profit religious Foundation, but my father had no intention of filing such a suit. He hoped Yogananda would straighten up. He was his former best friend. Although Yogananda and his lawyers accused my father of libel and slander for accusations of sexual misconduct in several published interviews, they never made any attempt to clear Yogananda’s name by filing a suit for defamation of character against my father. This is probably because the headline-making allegations, while irrelevant to the case at hand, did have corroborating witnesses, former students of Yogananda who had eventually fled the Center, and would have been forced to testify. My father clammed up after that. Some of these women are now elderly but still alive and still angry.

My father felt that the publicity he had generated had damaged the reputation of the few East Indians in the country at the time, particularly the other Yogis he knew, and he wanted the publicity to go away."

Edited by: Ek Balam at: 2/21/04 3:05 am

didgeridootoo
(4/3/04 7:57 am)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
Used Yogi,

I wrote you personally since you asked. Basically Walrus really doesn't want to discuss issues about Yogananda here, even though they have this section, not unless putting up this section means that they have changed their minds. It isn't a topic that I will be posting information on due to reading "Core Issues" - "The Real Question" on this board and seeing that some were banned from posting about Yogananda. I basically wrote to you because you were asking and no one was replying. Basically Cult Busters-SRF Division has become the place to talk about Kriya and Yogananda. But it appears to me more of an information board than a board where people are talking back and forth, why I don't know, just that the few who are posting are just hunters and gathers, and not many have shown up to discuss.

seekerseeking
Registered User
(4/4/04 10:09 am)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior REALLY? :)
Didger, I think the bannings may have resulted more from the way some of the participants in that thread were behaving than from the topic. As you have said, otherwise Walrus wouldn't have left the thread up or have kept this section open. I hope it is alright to discuss this issue. If Walrus asks us not to, then I won't discuss it anymore.

Soulcircle, I agree, you have to be more straightforward and write "in plain English". Something that exasperates me is when people beat around the bush too much. One only has so much time to read and post in these boards. Something else I can't stand is when people tell me "I know something you don't, that would change your mind if you did, but I can't tell you." That always elicits the "put up or shut up" remark from me.

I also think you have mistaken me for one of those bliss bunny devotees who must believe that Yogananda was perfect or their worlds will come crumbling down. I certainly don't know where you got that impression of me because if you read the few posts I have made so far anything but the contrary should be evident. I do not need Yogananda or any guru to be perfect. I do not even believe Jesus was perfect, because I do not believe perfection exists in the material world at all. Vedanta teaches us that the only perfection is Absolute Brahman.

I will summarize what I wrote in another post: the charges against Yogananda coming from many camps strike me as phony because the motivations of the people making the allegations seem transparent. To me the basic two points are as follows:

1- Babaji chose Yogananda to bring his message to the world, not any of his critics (Nerode, Dhirananda, Satyeswarananda, etc.). Some of them can't seem to be able to stand that.

2- It seems strage, even almost unique, that in the case of the sexual allegations, not one of the alleged victims has spoken up. Only third parties are alleging that this supposedly went on.

The allegations against Yogananda seem to fall into a few main categories:

1- Allegations about corruption (Nerode, Dhirananda, etc.)
2- Sexual allegations
3- Allegations against his teachings (watering down Kriya), displaying powers, arrogance (using Paramahansa as part of his name), etc. Some have gone so far as to allege that he was never a real Paramahansa to begin with and made the whole thing up.

Yes, I believe Yogananda was of mixed character like everything else that exists in the universe. I've just yet to see convincing evidence that at least some of the more serious charges were true.

Used Yogi
Registered User
(4/4/04 12:22 pm)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
Dig,

Thanks and sorry if I shouldn't have cross-posted the message. I did for two reasons: I hadn't known that there was an SRF Cult Busters board, and I didn't see that complete information on SRF Walrus. I thought others might like to see the article (looks like a lot more people have read SRF Walrus than Cult Busters) and I thought others would like to know about the SRF Cult Busters board.

stermejo
Registered User
(4/4/04 1:52 pm)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
Use and Didg,

I want to jump in here and address *some* of these issues.

First, regarding the bubble bath hijinks. Nerode's record gives me a bit more assurance: I once read a book about the founder of India's SwamiNarayan sect and was surprised to find at least a single recorded similar incident of bedroom fellowship. I found it strange the writer didn't make a big deal of it.

At the time I read the book, SwamiNarayan was a sect virtually unknown in the West. Since then, the sect has spread West and it wouldn't surprise me if the book was no longer available. A similar thing happened to then Bubba FreeJohn's book and movie, Grabage and the Godess. As soon as the guy got popular that book and movie went away.

Anyway, I wonder if this type of thing and the Hindu attitude toward it might go back as far as Krishna stealing the Gopi's clothes, the Kama Sutra (written by Vatsayana, an ex-monk) and the Konarak Temple? Never thinking of PY in a similar situation, I let it go.

I believe Nerode's account. And, PY's behavior was completely inappropriate. Even though America has Hugh, Brittany, Jenna and Howard, we're still shy on sex. That's okay with me. In some respects, India seems to have an opposite view. I remember reading a discription of the (beautiful) Indian film goddesses, at least on screen, as "look but don't touch."

Second, this is in general to your question about Kryia. If PY nabbed Kryia, Recharging, and other techniques, from someone else, why doesn't he say so? Perhaps, blame Sri Yukteshwar. At least, where he says to take a truth and make it your own. PY took that too much to heart for copyright purposes. I guess, the Grey Ladies would have to take him to court.

Speaking for myself, I've been practicing long enough that I don't cringe when *somebody* quacks about embellishments.

"You gave 'em to me. Their mine, now!" *-)

Third, where's the discussion?

Well, there IS plenty of discussion on this board. Currently, we're in a bit of a lull. Now, I'm busy with projects at home, plus work and school. Probably, similar circumstances apply even more so to others.

If you go back over posts for the past 9 months, the connection is this: Like SRF lessons, the Internet should be labeled FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY. No one comes to an Internet chat room or posting board to be intellectually bludgeoned or abused. Many of us are recovering from the past 9 months. 'Nuff said.

Hang in there!

soulcircle
(4/4/04 7:11 pm)
Reply 		the Patanjali tape/a talk by Yogananda
Hello Guests and All,

Can someone get a copy of the Patanjali tape to me, or transcribe it themselves in here?

Quote:
More significant rumors could be brought up, and subject to careful extensive research and thoughtfulness, some of the rumors not generating evidence, others generating it, yet if communication problems and passionate arguing arise, there might be a pointlessness in such a pursuit.


Quote:
With success and listening and an absense of name calling etc. we can go on from the "Patanjali tape" to more research , maybe not, maybe.


Thank you all for your replies, I envision this thread as a never-ending source of civil questions, research and development with, helpful, generally accepted infomation. If necessary a new ezboard can be developed/created.

One worthy of the mature respect for truth, quoted and paraphrased in the opening post of this thread. One reflective of the unique spiritual personalities of Yogananda and ourselves.

soulcircle
heypoet@aol.com

Edited by: soulcircle at: 4/4/04 7:24 pm
didgeridootoo
(4/5/04 2:37 am)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
Used Yogi,

I see no harm in cross-posting. I had done the same with that post after reading it. I just became leery that others on this board were banned after posting on The Real Question. Perhaps, Seeker is correct, it could be the way they did it.

didgeridootoo
(4/5/04 2:45 am)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
I have never heard of Patanjali's tape and wonder why it would be important? What is in it? I also think that we would learn more of Yogananda from reading the court record between he and Swami Dhirananda, that is, the case that Dhirananda won after claiming that he wrote much of Yogananda's works. In that case it has also been claimed that Yogananda lied, but I would prefer the truth over allegations.

didgeridootoo
(4/5/04 1:20 pm)
Reply 		Re: Humans are multi-faceted in their behavior
Soulcircle quoted from someone:

"I find Yogananda to be one of the best friends I have in this life and will ever have in any life." As for myself, I find Lorna, Ben Erskine's wife, to be one of the best friends I will ever have in any life. I have other very good friends as well, but I am very grateful to Yogananda for having fathered Ben, who is also wonderful, but also and mainly because of Lorna.

Soulcircle also wrote: "I love him is whatever life he lived, not in any portrayal from second hand or a distance, but in his actual life, human and compassionate". You cannot help but love him for the life he lived, for his humaness and compassion. You may not want to follow him because of what he did, but love him, yes, because he was human and compassionate in his life.

soulcircle
(4/10/04 7:31 pm)
Reply 		time permitting a new board on ezboard
Hi Guests, All and seekerseeking,

seekerseeking, you have written:
Quote:
Well, soulcircle . . . where is all this devastating evidence you said you had?


what is not clear about the opening post in this thread?

in the opening post you may have read:
Quote:
So in this thread let's take healthy kind steps.
And I will start with evidence that we can all have and work with and print word for word.

Evidence of a somewhat non-controversial nature, a small step before bigger steps with more evidence.

Slow maybe, yet necessary, this is for ALL, perhaps for a couple centuries!



this isn't about impatience, or for those with the intent of departing from slow methodical research, to the language of the antithesis of calm research such as words like "devasting."

It will be as the opening explains for the newest and oldest students. For the new students, to be able to see the transcript and even have the tape of the "Patanjali tape," along with their other early readings.

For those more senior students to calmly gather and without an agenda, share PY as he expressed compassion and lived his life in India and the States, in fuller and more trustable portrayal than available from SRF.

This thread is quickly approaching a point of not having any contributons from me, as I will open some time a new ezboard, that can pursue this in open studiousness, truth, a patient opening of truth free of devastation. I will use my postition as moderator to screen posts so that team members post who are academic and archive minded, free of all ranting,

and even milder things such as your desire to know now, in very incomplete and unprepared manner, the evidence I have gleaned over 38 years from 11 or 12 non-monastic "direct discliples" and other sources.

You seekerseeking missed in what a casual read would have revealed, that I am awaiting the text of the "Patanjali tape," and this first small step to build on.

From some of these other sources and the personal face to face time with non-monastic direct disciples in these almost 4 decades...........

Individuals and some times records (including books), came, and I hope this will be of value to people

came:

1) as the result of nurtured friendships and trust, the object was never to pry info

2) came of its own, i was giving my respect to these individuals and different persons and private libraires, and giving of what i was

(by the way I am a recipient of some unexpected and treasured compassion from others throughout my life, and when I can be at my best, I try to give the world a little vision and compassion, that people gave to me freely...I have always lived among community and been invited into community)

3) came perhaps because when I can be humble, laughing, once every four years on Feb. 29th, raindrops and dew gather like in a valley, unlike when I am proud and nothing gathers on the mountaintop, having been swept clear by gales of harshness

SO in a new ezboard without the violence, unneeded character-slamming
or even the hint of greedy grabbing or impatience, the truth,

the truth a quoted writer, speaks of in the first post, the team will move ahead. calmly pursuing the goal of an open sharing of PY life, proving that the task SRF missed or found impossible of representing the remarkable spiritual personalty Yogananda---

that the open sharing of Yogananda's life will be inevitable, if not for All for an indefinite future,

at least for a handful, a team, a family of those like me who has shaded itself at times in others' nurturance, and who at times has soothed those who, for awhile came out of the heat of the name-calling and dog-eat dog world.

again Yogananda lived a life of compassion, had a multi-faceted life and I love him from this life and others as a friend

soulcircle

Edited by: soulcircle at: 4/10/04 8:17 pm
seekerseeking
Registered User
(4/11/04 10:34 am)
Reply 		Re: time permitting a new board on ezboard
soulcircle,

May I remind you that my challenge to you came as a response to your message to me dated 3/29/04, titled SOMEDAY WE'LL SEE HOW OPEN in which you wrote:

Quote:
Someday we'll see how open you are, I have all the evidence I need

Also, if you ever get the chance, rethink your perspective of Anil, even to the point of getting directly in touch with him

His dad was so "mediocre," that hewa probably the one who Rajasi first heard and got connected to PY. He also was with Tagore and Gandhi before coming to the US in 1919 or 1920

I have the Science of Religion edition with Dhira's name on cover with PY's. Dhira is quite a study!!

There's always more!


In light of that, I think it is perfectly reasonable for me to ask you to deliver your goods or else stop your empty threats.

Your words and attemps to slam me are worthless.

All your attempts to insult me are as empty as the other 759 messages you've posted on this board, the contents of which could easily be whittled down into one or two messages.

So do as you please, I don't care. I just wanted you to openly confirm, here before all, my suspicions that you are full of it. Thanks for doing that nicely.

Enjoy all your four decades of dirt on Yogananda. I have better things to do with my time.

Used Yogi
Registered User
(4/11/04 10:56 am)
Reply 		Dhirananda / The Science of Religion
I found this on Ananda's website. It gives more on the Dhirananda/Science of Religion issue. I haven't seen this information elsewhere on The SRF Walrus so I'm posting a link.

www.godisforeveryone.com/

soulcircle
(4/11/04 10:58 am)
Reply 		others of you -----
Hello Guests and All,

when the new board is open, as mentioned two posts above, we will succeed in sharing the "Patanjali tape" with all---

also i can already see that there would be value in introducing one or two direct non monastic disciples

we would even have the opportunity to look at Anil Nerode from a distance, seeing the esteem that he is held in at Cornell, and discussing his father's books at length, a partner before their separation with Yogananda, a friend of Tagore and Gandhi who came to America, a yogi who came in 1919 or 1920

the books by Dhirananda would ran mother center before Sri Nerode (Anil's dad) and sri Nerode's wife did, are availabe

these two men opening centers and many things were a part of Yogananda's life more than just the running of mother center

Dhirananda needn't be a bigger mystery than necessary. Mejda tells of him living as a youth at Yogananda's home.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

and without the tone that seekerseeking avails himself of

soulcircle

soulcircle
(4/11/04 11:01 am)
Reply 		Used Yogi, you are greatly appreciated
thank you

you certainly will be needed on the team at the new ezboard, where this thread will be continued, free of anything but the open relaxed on-going sharing of truth

again thank you Used Yogi

seekerseeking
Registered User
(4/11/04 11:11 am)
Reply 		Re: It's time to cut the bull and get real
This stuff about Dhirananda (and Nerode) has been around for ages. I myself have known about it for years. I fail to see how it proves the point of the Yogananda bashers. All it proves is that Dhirananda and Nerode were two extremely ambitious individuals who had different agendas. They wanted name and fame, they didn't want to be second and third fiddle to Yogananda, so they struck out on their own. It happens in the world all the time. Of course, when they leave, it's always necessary to throw a little dirt on the face of the Master who brought them to America, and housed them and fed them.

soulcircle writes, in his inimitable passive-aggressive style:

Quote:
you certainly will be needed on the team at the new ezboard, where this thread will be continued, free of anything but the open relaxed on-going sharing of truth


This "relaxed on-going sharing of truth" of yours means you will continue stringing people along for years like you've been doing here, saying "if you suck up to me, and kiss my butt, and write me and call me and humble yourself to me for years and years, I might, might, see fit to maybe think about telling you the few juicy tidbits of gossip and dirt I have on Yogananda"?

How spiritual.....

seekerseeking
Registered User
(4/11/04 11:14 am)
Reply 		Re: passive-aggressive "soulcircle"
Quote:
and without the tone that seekerseeking avails himself of


It's the tone you set in your message to me.

soulcircle
(4/11/04 11:30 pm)
Reply 		Re: does anyone get the feeling
Hi Guests and All,

does ayone get the feeling that seekerseeking is representative of many, many people who want Yogananda always in a sanitized historical sketch, as mentioned in the opening post?

Quote:
He was I believe, a unique spiritual personality. And the issue of whether or not, moments of humaness that some may see in a bad light, even if only one insignificant remark in questionable/bad taste, even if there were these moments they don't in my mind diminish his spirituality for me. I realized many years ago SRF could not be trusted. For some reason, they have felt the need to sanitize every detail of Yogananda's life and eliminate many of his human characteristcs from any public mention.


i would almost guess that there are many who til their dying breath would "kill the messenger,"
while others of us make available sketches of Yogananda as he was.......one of the "as he was," the now often quoted comments at Lake Shrine near the end of his life that SRF does not get out to people:

Quote:
"We must build colonies wherein we can shape the youth who are willing -- hundred percent willing -- to have jobs, happiness, freedom, and produce food for their own use.... All our vegetables are grown by our boys which supply close to 200 people. So they are -- we are not charged in the ordinary sense. For one hour, we build a great big edifice, and then we pray for people to come and sit. We don't ask. Whoever comes willingly, fine. Whoever doesn't, we don't coax. We want hearts. I prefer a soul to a crowd, and I love crowds of souls. SO THE GREATEST THING IN THE CHURCH MOVEMENT IS THE BUILDING OF COLONIES to take the surplus of industry and to educate the American youth in character building."

".... This sort of colony, I hope the Governer, with all my humbleness, emphasizes character education in the schools, AND BUILDING OF THESE COLONIES WHERE THEY CAN HAVE THEIR JOBS, HOME, CHARACTER, CHURCH, AND FREEDOM IN THE SAME PLACE. And I have found the greatest results by that way. But I have some people of great educatable ability, we are now starting, we have started already a goat dairy, and another colony is starting in Phoenix. We have quite a few colonies in India. BUT THE COLONY SYSTEM IS SUCCEEDING BECAUSE IT ISN'T A CHURCH FOR ONE HOUR -- BUILD A GREAT BIG EDIFICE. TIE UP SO MUCH MONEY. You see, we have simple construction and beauty.....It is all done by our own people...."



it is his humanity, you call it dirt, I don't
and bringing the words above to all who come here is a big part of my interest!!

why are we only entitled to a version, an inaccurate version through SRF's filter?

soulcicle

Edited by: soulcircle at: 4/11/04 11:32 pm
rachelcorrie
Registered User
(4/12/04 12:47 am)
Reply 		http://www.pub101.ezboard.com/bscriptteam
Hi Guests and All,

it is written higher in this thread:

Quote:
SO in a new ezboard without the violence, unneeded character-slamming or even the hint of greedy grabbing or impatience, the truth,

the truth a quoted writer, speaks of in the first post, the team will move ahead. calmly pursuing the goal of an open sharing of PY life, proving that the task SRF missed or found impossible of representing the remarkable spiritual personalty Yogananda---

that the open sharing of Yogananda's life will be inevitable, if not for All for an indefinite future,

at least for a handful, a team, a family of those like me who has shaded itself at times in others' nurturance, and who at times has soothed those who, for awhile came out of the heat of the name-calling and dog-eat dog world.

again Yogananda lived a life of compassion, had a multi-faceted life and I love him from this life and others as a friend



pub101.ezboard.com/bscriptteam

has been created

The board is Script Team, and when the script is completed, plays can be imagined or actually performed of Yogananda's life and the people around Yogananda!!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~

somewhat along the lines mentioned above

the viewing is restricted as is the posting

you may email me
heypoet@aol.com

dave/rachelcorrie/soulcircle

Edited by: rachelcorrie at: 4/12/04 6:06 am
soulcircle
(4/12/04 7:12 am)
Reply 		Re: wiser souls (WindChimes44) chime in!!!!!!!
Hello Guest and All,
Don't read this, I am just getting over the whole passive-agressive junk.

1) I apologize to seekerseeking, what a stupid jerk I am

2) Thank you WindChimes44 for these good words from another thread!!

Quote:
Seeker,

I saw that 'multifaceted' thread was heating up. I've been here too short a time to know my way around the undercurrents that seem to always be where groups of humans are. It seems we are bound to give each other hives for sometimes clear and sometimes nearly inexplicable reasons from time to time.

The great thing is that we can just post in threads that interest us, and reply to messages selectively. That is much better than hives at closer quarters! (Many of my friends currently have nearly grown, extra annoying, yet dearly loved teenagers at home. Now that is the interpersonal hives too close for comfort!)

My new interest in buddhist thought leads me to say that those who irritate us give us the opportunity to develop tolerance. That is so much easier said than done. Trying it is proving very interesting for me. (At least partly as in the chinese curse 'May you live in interesting times' ha!) I'm batting much less than 500 so far, but the effort feels useful, and even pleasant. The idea is not that one must be passive, or accept anything one differs with, but just that one remains calm and sees the being providing the irritation as a kindly workout partner at another level of reality. I am enjoying trying that outlook. I get annoyed or even angry, then step back and remember all manifestation is at one level the One. It shifts my whole context quite refreshingly. Of course, it would be nice if I were not angry to begin with. But I am where I am and that's ok.

Some internet gathering spots, however, are verbal WWF Smashdown, and those I have decided are not my preferred entertainment. This board seems to allow people to have the full range of emotion yet weed out relentless ranters and provocateurs. I appreciate that too!


again, you maybe be so very right seekerseeking and I don't desire any further dispute,

soulcircle

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