>
SRF Walrus
Mt. Washington, Ca
Open discussions about SRF
Gold Community SRF Walrus
    > Layoffs - The downsizing of SRF has begun
        > Logic? Is SRF acting with kindness and humility?		 New Topic    Add Reply

<< Prev Topic | Next Topic >>
Author Comment
member108
Registered User
(11/27/02 8:09 am)
Reply 		Logic? Is SRF acting with kindness and humility?
In Guruji's own words, "If you all work together with love, harmony, kindness, and humility, the work will sweep the world."

Since the work is shrinking, not sweeping the world, logic would seem to indicate that they are not working together with love, harmony, kindness, and humility?

Gitano no divino
Registered User
(11/29/02 8:09 am)
Reply 		Re: Logic? Is SRF acting with kindness and humility?
Well, the absence of harmony is pretty clear. However, an absence of complete harmony does not doom an enterprise to failure. In fact, dissent, debate, and disagreement--even of an inharmonious variety--are often necessary for a group of people to achieve an objective. Look at the conduct of any successful military or political campaign, or of vast engineering projects. Success results from the uninhibited sharing of opinions and information, not from the prevalence of complete harmony, which usually translates as abject submission to the will of a supreme leader. World War II is the classic case of this. There was acrimonious dispute between the Americans and English as to how to conduct the war, and Eisenhower and Montgomery and Patton were famous for their squabbles and rivalries--and for their ultimate triumph. The other model (of which PY was a sneaking admirer) was for absolute, "harmonious" submission to the will of an enlightened savior figure--Hitler (or PY's hero, Mussolini). The results of the collision of these two systems are there in the history books for any who are intellectually curious enough to learn the lessons of past, lest they need to be repeated. On the basis of this, I would say that SRF's problem has been too much harmony (imposed from above) rather than too much dissent. If the leadership would listen to the dissenters, it might learn a thing or two. But that would undermine their claim to spiritual supremacy.

Moreover, I would say that PY's vision was grandiose, hyperbolic, and naively utopian. This topic has been addressed elsewhere on this board, i.e., the tendency of teachings and teacher in SRF to lurch to all-or-nothing extremes. The idea that SRF is somehow the religion of a new age is not a conceit unique to it; most cults embrace a similar messianic self-image. This sort of proclamation demonstrates not how special but rather how painfully ordinary SRF was/is. I think that in such statements we find reason not only to critique the organization but its founder. He would have displayed much greater prescience and perspicacity had he set realistic goals and expectations that were within the bounds of, well, for lack of a better word, um--realization. As is so often the case in the SRF teachings, however, people--individually and collectively--are set up for failure by what one might label hyperidealism. Expectations are ratcheted up so high that there is no other possibility than eventual disillusionment, and a crushing sense of inadequacy. Hence, the Walrus.

In my opinion, no matter how much harmony prevailed in SRF, it was never destined to "sweep the world." It is not the religion of a new age, as there is no new age (indeed, I reject the whole notion of ages, at least as laid out in Hindu mythohistory). In fact, current events suggest to me that no higher age can or will be achieved as long as humanity is shackled to the superstitions of religion in general. As we've stated before, PY's vision was clouded by the delusion that he was a god-man. Thus, he made all kinds of statements and predictions that we would do well to dismiss out of hand, based on our own common sense and experience. At the very least, everything he said must be passed through the filter of our own critical discrmination. (What if the Germans had done this with Hitler, or the Italians with Mussolini? But as Hitler observed, people are sheep and easily led.) The above is one such item that should be filtered out. Naturally, this does not pardon in the least the behavior of SRF and its current leadership. But they do not bear the burden of responsibility by themselves. PY set them up for this by giving them a mission they couldn't fulfill--that no one could fulfill, least of all himself-- and without providing them with adequate training (in business, accounting, etc.). Indeed, he presented an example of authoritarianism that they have emulated to perfection. Thus, they refuse to share power and control with others better suited to the tasks now facing the organization (witness the PeopleSoft debacle). The results were and are eminently predictable, without any benefit of clairvoyance.

Dictatorship does not work; democracy does (more or less). The problem with an organization like SRF is that it was founded by a supposed incarnation of divinity. What he said, therefore, cannot be challenged or refuted. In his own time, he did not invite dissent or disagreement. Indeed, if we are to believe Srflongago (and I certainly do), PY was something of a control freak who would not and could not delegate authority. He did not encourage individual initiative or anything else that would have eroded his absolute control. Since he was not, in fact, omnipotent, he took on a burden he was not able to handle. In the process, the truly capable people left his organization, leaving behind a residue of syncophancy. His minions, not surprisingly, have done exactly the same. Those who get ahead in SRF do so by sucking up to the Bad Ladies. When the BL's are gone and their yes-men are in charge, will we witness some miraculous transformation? Not at all likely.

We must realize, however, that once you set yourself up as an enlightened being, you cannot brook dissent. The very idea of tolerating disagreement suggests that some unenlightened disciple might know or see something you don't, and that would undermine your claim to spiritual superiority. The god-man must know all and be not just the final authority but the ONLY authority. Everything he does and says, and everything that happens as a result (whether good or bad), is attributed to god, whose instrument he pretends to be. This is too great a load for any mortal to carry, and in the end we see that all such god-men were no more than that: mortal, like ourselves. Their conceit and self-deception are their undoing. We are still on the safe side, however; we can choose unflinching honesty, though it may not always be comforting.

This is why I have stated elsewhere that the problems in SRF go beyond a set of individuals, an organization, or even the founder. They are hardwired into the teachings themselves. We must steadfastly reject the notion that there are such things as enlightened beings--because such beings have been the cause of so much mischief in the world.

Edited by: Gitano no divino at: 11/29/02 12:56:21 pm
redpurusha
Registered User
(12/9/02 11:29 am)
Reply 		Re: Logic? Is SRF acting with kindness and humility?
Quote:
We must steadfastly reject the notion that there are such things as enlightened beings--because such beings have been the cause of so much mischief in the world.


"Those who cannot bring themselves to believe in the divinity of any man, will ultimately realize the divinity in their own selves." -PY

astral7
Registered User
(1/23/03 7:44 pm)
Reply 		Re: Logic? Is SRF acting with kindness and humility?
I think it is not unusual for any org/company to go through various rates of growth[the SRF may just be downsizing as a move to become more efficient with the use of donated money.]

There was a news article that in Salt lake city the M....m church is laying off 500 employees, maybe donations are down?

As for growth - yes Self-Realization Fellowship is definitely sweeping the world. It's % of growth in the last 10 years is good. They must be doing a lot of things right. Not everything, as growth demands new approaches and renovating of organizational proceedures.

This Self-Realization Fellowship growth is quite remarkable when compared to many other orgs.

Since may yogis are of an independent nature, and in their 30s & 40's when they join[ so the children are not always taking on their parents faith] the families are usually smaller, and there is no Proselytizing program.

There are no extra real demands made on SRF devotees that would not come with anyone who wishes to commit to a self-directed spiritual program. It is a system where devotees are truly responsible for their own progress - unless they do not yet understand what they are reading.

The main requirement to progress with a true guru is learning how to listen.

IDL astral7



KS
Registered User
(1/25/03 6:05 am)
Reply 		SRF is sweeping the world?
SRF is sweeping the world? Please. We should require some degree of real experience with SRF if someone is going to post messages here.

Many of us have been there, seen the lesson applications come in and see the attendance and donation figures.

<< Prev Topic | Next Topic >>

Add Reply

Email This To a Friend Email This To a Friend
Topic Control Image Topic Commands
Click to receive email notification of replies Click to receive email notification of replies
Click to stop receiving email notification of replies Click to stop receiving email notification of replies
jump to:

- SRF Walrus - Layoffs - The downsizing of SRF has begun -



Powered By ezboardŽ Ver. 7.32
Copyright Š1999-2005 ezboard, Inc.