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Just Asking
Unregistered User
(12/23/01 7:16 am)
Reply 		Is this the SRF manifesto
I picked up this posting somewhere on the Internet , it was written in a review of a yogananda book, looks like some heavy conditioning / brain-washing is been done here


Please do know that Self-Realization Fellowship ("SRF") is the true organization that the Master, the Gurus, and God established to publish, and minister the teachings to the world in their purest form. In Los Angeles at the SRF Mother Center, he trained monks and nuns to live the life of Christ, he often said, and live for God and serve Him through the work. This has been confused by the many organizations started by many of his disciples who left SRF and are teaching Kriya Yoga in many parts of the world. Many of these disciples are good-intentioned and I have read and treasure their writings and books. But do know this, the Kriya Yoga they've learned was given to them through SRF and there is a great difference between that given by others and that given by SRF. The technique may be the same, but the spiritual power and blessings of the Gurus are not.

Many that left the SRF organization had personal desires that caught up with them and they followed their own will, not giving it up to serve God through the work. Their personal desires deluded them to thinking that their "mission" was to "lead" rather than to "follow". In many instances the Master commented when they left, "Delusion has caught up with thembut I shall be with them." But to some he said, "If you leave now, it will take you many incarnations to find God." Some yogis, even when they reach high states, are still deluded by maya. He stated, no one is truly safe from maya until they have entered nirbikalpa samadhi from which there is no fall! Every state under that, one can fall from. So be very careful when you read of the Master's Kriya Yoga being taught elsewhere. He stated many times that his coming and his establishment of the work of Self-Realization Fellowship was a Special Dispensation of God!

I have been told that those who received Kriya initiation at the Mother Center as opposed to other organizations branching off from disciples who left have realized a deeper atunement and blessing in the SRF organization. Yoganandaji stated many times that even after he was gone, he and the Gurus would bless, watch over, protect, and guide all sincere Kriya Yogis who follow and practice the teachings faithfully with devotion and diligence. This is not to say they won't bless and guide those in other oraganizations. BUT, Self-Realization Fellowship is the world-wide organization he founded for the distribution and dissemination of the uncorrupted, undiluted teachings of the Gurus. He has stated that Babaji has already predetermined and chosen the future presidents of SRF, as it is in the ether. So this need not be debated. Whoever is at the head of SRF is chosen by God and the Gurus and they reflect that Cosmic Consciousness , do not doubt it. The monks and nuns at the Mother Center and abroad are rishis of this age, modern day saints , just like those written of in his Autobiography!! Realize this when you meet some of the original disciples, and some new ones, too. These are very real and sacred things I am speaking of.

Brother Anandamoy mentioned that the master had said something like, "If you think the organization is big now, you should see it 2000 years from now!!"

--------------------------------------


"So be very careful when you read of the Master's Kriya Yoga being taught elsewhere"

I AM SPEECHLESS :eek

XInsider
Unregistered User
(12/23/01 10:41 am)
Reply 		The "manifesto"
Yep. This is it. Soup to nuts. No pun intended.

me
Unregistered User
(12/23/01 1:29 pm)
Reply 		Proof of BOD's insecurity
Why is SRF spending so much time and money in law suits to discredit other organizations?

If I truly know that I am the best piano player in the world, why would I need to chop off the head of a mediocre piano player? and with the excuse of keeping the music pure? All I need to do is play my concerts and let people draw their own conclusions.

In Recovery
Unregistered User
(12/23/01 9:46 pm)
Reply 		Manifesto
Dear Just Asking,

Whoever this person is who wrote the review, I question the validity of their quotes of Master and whether they are taken out of context. However, I accept the review as evidence of how such quotes have been misunderstood and have become a damaging belief system in SRF.

Almost subconsciously I absorbed these thoughts into my belief system via the devotee grapevine before I entered the ashram, and also via countless intimations (although rarely expressed explicitly) in the years of tape classes and services in the ashram. We listened to taped classes, where Mrinalini Mata blurs the line between leaving the ashram and leaving the guru, and that this "leaving" incurs a several incarnation detour. This was a huge bogeyman for me when I was trying to decide whether to stay in or leave the ashram. Such a fear-based belief has great power to hold a person for a long time in an environment that is no longer healthy for them, and it is one of the most fearful and damaging beliefs we could absorb. But it is raw B.S. No normal loving person, much less an incarnation of love, would treat others in such a manner. Somehow this belief has gotten a lot of power without being checked by SRF. I find it difficult to believe that SRF is not aware that such erroneous beliefs exist, and I wish these were addressed in the Frequently Asked Questions booklet.

I have heard only of one particular case when a senior monk was doing tremendous damage to Master’s work and was being treacherous. Master supposedly said to a nearby monastic that this man would be lost to the path for several incarnations. Whatever karmic principle applied to this very specific case has been misconstrued as a universal law that damns any sincere soul who leaves the ashram.

In Journey to Self-realization, chapter 12, Master says: “God drown Self-Realization if ever it becomes an organization that is only eager to fill halls and draw crowds of people without having, foremost, the desire to give them Self-realization.” This suggests that in Master’s mind SRF is not untouchable merely because it is the organization he created to disseminate his Kriya teachings. He is more concerned about the fruit it produces. We must reach our own conclusions, based on observance of SRF’s behavior (and the fruits thereof), as to what its foremost desire is. Is it to produce people of Self-realization? Or is its foremost desire to protect its position as the exclusive disseminator and keeper of the pure teachings of Paramahansa Yogananda and to produce cookie-cutter members who don’t rock the boat.

As for SRF Kriyabans having greater attunement with Master than do those of other organizations, again I say it’s B.S. My personal experience has led me to the conviction that there are devils and angels to be found in every organization.

Re: “The technique may be the same, but the spiritual power and blessings of the Gurus are not.”

In the Introduction to the Self-Realization Lessons, page 4, we read: “Hence every SRF student should understand and respect the significance of the link of SRF Gurus--Jesus Christ, Bhagavan Krishna, Mahavatar Babaji, Lahiri Mahasaya, Sri Yukteswar, and Paramahansa Yogananda--with whom all SRF students are connected by affiliation with Self-Realization Fellowship. Those who desire the help of these Gurus in finding God should follow the way that the Gurus have shown. There are students who do not follow the teachings, yet expect spiritual benefits just the same. Those benefits will not come! An SRF student should never go to bed without first giving his deepest attention to God.

“Those who practice the SRF techniques of meditation daily, with sincere devotion to the Lord, will find by their own Self-realization the validity of SRF teachings. SRF asks no one to believe blindly, but to use the methods offered in these sacred teachings. By being loyal to the Gurus in this way, the student makes it possible for the Gurus to guide him surely to the Divine Goal.”

This is where I need some help. What does everyone think about these words of Masters? (I think they are from him).

Unknown
(4/3/06 11:44 am)
Reply 		Unknown
(This post is missing and can not be restored)

willy1080
Unregistered User
(12/30/01 9:46 am)
Reply 		Monks leaving the Org
>>>In many instances the Master commented when they left, "Delusion has caught up with them but I shall be with them." But to some he said, "If you leave now, it will take you many incarnations to find God." <<<

Going by the above statements , I thought it apt to add one story here , which I find extremely inspiring , instilling hope when doubts gnaw at my heart . Instead of condemning someone with the whip of "Loyalty to guruji" a little bit of compassion and kindness is all that is needed
This story which I would like to share is about Nisargadatta maharaj , a guru with a somewhat similar approach to Ramana Maharshi .

----------------------------------------------------
Buddhist teacher Jack Kornfield describes his encounter
with Nisargadatta Maharaj in "The Eightfold Path for the Householder

There's something in us, in our nature, which compels us to discover. I remember a very powerful moment with the old guru who I studied with, Nisargadatta Maharaj, who taught the way of Nisarga Yoga. "Nisarga" means natural. The basic translation of his name was "Mr. Natural". He was this 80-year old cigarette-smoking man. He had a little cigarette stand. He was kind
of a combination like Krishnamurti and Fritz Perls. He would put you on the hot seat when you came in and ask you about your spiritual life.

One day we were in a room about this big. People were coming in and asking questions. Somebody came in and asked a question and was a little bit dissatisfied and left. And another person raised their hand and said, "Maharaj, what will happen to that person who came and asked that question and left? Is it all over for them in this life? They didn't stay here. You are a great guru, and they weren't interested, and they went home." And he twinkled at that moment, he really lit up, and he said, "It's too late. Even the fact that they put their foot in this room, even if they hadn't asked the question, means that somewhere in there there's a seed of really knowing who we are and what this life is about. Not what you were taught in elementary school or what's on TV or the newspapers,but a deep seed of knowing our true nature, that wants to discover;
it's like coming home. The fact that he just walked in the room means that that seed has started to sprout. And no matter if he tries to forget it and goes back and gets lost, sooner or later that will manifest in awakening.



KS
Registered User
(12/30/01 6:48 pm)
Reply 		Great Story
What a wonderful reaction that master had! How positive.

How unlike what SRF members/monastics experience!

(P.S. How come SRF matas and senior monastics don't see it? too?)

Web site surfer
Unregistered User
(12/31/01 12:21 am)
Reply 		Monastics leaving
Yes, great story. But do not get caught in the lie that those monastics who have left SRF are missing the boat in this life. This is sort of what your story implies, even if you did not mean it that way. For more on this subject, see other stories on this board.

KS
Registered User
(12/31/01 8:26 am)
Reply 		Monastics
Yes, that part of the story does not match the SRF situation. I like the part of the story where the leader reacted to the devotee.

There are certainly enough stories here now where people should know why people are leaving SRF. That part doesn't match the story above.

willy1080
Registered User
(1/1/02 4:08 am)
Reply 		Re: Monastics leaving
Dear Surfer

The reason I put up this story , was to show that no one has to feel guilty to express dissent .It's a natural thing on any path .Instead of missing the boat in this incarnation, many who have left SRF have more chance of making faster progress , because of the freedom ,they will now experience.

If you were to read any biography of Swami Vivekananda , you will find a very interesting story about him and Sri Ramakrishna.
Ramakrishna was dying of cancer and on his death bed , one day ,while attending to him , Naren ( Swami Vivekananda ) thought to himself, that if his master was to declare himself as a avatar in this emancipated state , then and only then, would he accept him as a incarnation. That very moment, Sri ramakrishna lifted himself and said ," he who was Rama and he who was Krishna is now in this body , and not in your vedantic sense"
This is another inspiring story for all disciples, inspite of being one of the advanced disciples of Ramakrishna, Vivekananda was still wallowing in doubt and was not condemned for it .
If some-one as advanced as Swami Vivekanada could make mistakes, an ordinary disciple is bound to have his doubts. By continuously chanting “ loyalty to guruji” you might be propelling a few sensitive souls towards anxiety and even nervous breakdowns

It is full credit to the folks at Ramakrishna mission that they have carried this story , an SRF editor would have cut this story as it shows master in " poor light ".

Personally , I find it very dificult to beleive that Paramahansaji would have ever said some of the things that he is credited with , like a "strong centre" and those who leave will suffer for incarnations etc..

mattie jo
Unregistered User
(1/11/02 9:31 am)
Reply 		Monastics leaving
Dear Willie 1080,

Thank you for bringing up the issue of whether one would suffer for many incarnations if one leaves one's guru, etc. I asked a Swami of a different order, and I learned that it isn't true, that when one leaves the path, the minute that person changes his mind, he can return. The referernce you are referring to is in THE DIVINE ROMANCE, THAT GOD WITH YOU THROUGH LIFE, subtitle, The Guru Is Sent By God. That was a tough one for me, and it was thown into my face, so I checked it out. I don't know if Yogananda really said that or if SRF put that in there to scare us, I hope the latter.

onlylove
Unregistered User
(1/11/02 10:48 am)
Reply 		The Forgiveness of the Masters
Everything I've seen and heard about God and Gurus is that they are amazingly forgiving. Yes, one does have to pay the karmic price for mistakes, but they don't make you burn in hell for eternity.

One example: According to Master, Judas was reincarnated in India as a disciple of Sri Ramakrishna. And he became liberated in that lifetime! From a talk by K-riyananda:

"Do you suppose Jesus Christ hated Judas. Of course not....Yogananda said that he met Judas in this life-time and that he achieved liberation in this life after 2,000 years. I asked him, "What was he like?" He said, "Well, he still had some attachment to money, but he got rid of it." He said, "He was very much by himself. He was very withdrawn. The disciples one time teased him about his fondness for money, and the guru said, "Don't." But Jesus had appeared to the Master and asked him to free him in this lifetime."

onlylove

Mattie Jo
Unregistered User
(1/12/02 12:52 pm)
Reply 		Is This the SRF Manafesto?

Now I am ticked off. I have heard that statement of Yogananda's often since I found out what SRF was like and began questioning them. I wonder if he really made that statement or if SRF did?

It comes from the book THE DIVINE ROMANCE, and that statement is as follows: "He who cannot learn through the wisdom and love of his God-ordained guru will not find God in this life. Several incarnations at last must pass before he will have another such opportunity." Now I know that many believe in what Ramakrishna has to say, and his words are that even if a man leaves the path, the moment he returns, he is accepted back by God. I once called Vedanta Society and asked them this question without telling them where it came from. This is as bad as what the Christian threat of hell. But what if it were true? What does it matter how many lifetimes it takes to get to God. Once when a Christian threatened me with words of going to hell because I didn't believe in God his way, I said, "I can love God just as easily in hell." And another thing, IF and that is a big IF, Yogananda said that, he was implying listening to him, not to an organization.

I once talked with the center that Mother Hamilton, a direct disciple of Yogananda's, created when she left SRF. She was devasted. She saw the changes that SRF was making to the lessons, to the kriya, etc. and she tried to stop it. She was blacklisted, and she used to counsel people, but now they would not let her counsel anyone, nor would they allow devotees to talk to her when they called Mother Center. They also said the most derogatory things about her to others. When she left she finally went to see Swami Ramdass, and he helped her get through this. Yogananda once said to Mother Hamilton, "Your loyalty is to me, not to an organizaton."

We in SRF have been sheltered from the truth, because we feel that we should not go and talk to any other group about these things, but those who have are learning that some things that SRF teaches are not true teachings.

How many of you have checked out the original writings of Yogananda's and found all the changes in them? I found these changes very unsettling. When I asked SRF, I was told that Yogananda made these changes. Yet, every edition of the AUTO book has been changed, so if Yogananda made these changes, why weren't they made all at once? I learned how they make changes, and I was shocked. I called Mother Center and talked with a mata, and when I asked her a question that was in the lessons that I didn't understand, she said, "Oh, well, that is confusing, that doesn't need to be in there. Next time they redo the lessons I will ask them to take it out." It was a kriya lesson, and I thought that it was important or Yogananda would not have put it in there, but I guess SRF doesn't think so.

I think Jesus said it so well. "Father forgive; they know not what they do."






Mattie Jo
Unregistered User
(1/12/02 4:24 pm)
Reply 		Is this the SRF Manafesto?
Dear In Recovery,

The last two statements that you made concerning the introduction to the lessons, the ones where you want to know what others think. They sound like they are statements that SRF made, not Yogananda. I have his original Yogata Lessons, and there is no introduction, he just went straight to the lessons. Often SRF has added to these lessons. Remember the lessons on staying out of the sun?

Ah, ha. I see what is bothering you. "With whom all SRF students are connected by affiliation with SRF." I have often seen in comparing original writings with what SRF is putting out now, that they change things to make one more loyal to SRF. And example is in the AUTO book. In the first edition, under THE SCIENCE OF KRIYA YOGA, it says, "The actual technique (Kriya) must be learned from a Kriyaban or Kriya Yogi; here a broad reference must suffice." In my 1971 AUTO book it says, "The actual technique should be learned from an autorized Kriyaban (Kriya Yogi) of SRF-YSS. Here a board reference must suffice." The latest change, and I don't have a book to check it out, says, "And a narrow reference must suffice." I have seen when comparing that they have often made it seem that you have to be loyal to SRF in order to be loyal to Yogananda.

KS
Registered User
(1/12/02 8:23 pm)
Reply 		Cult
The closer you look the more you see SRF as just a disappointing cult. It was founded by a true Master, but become in a very short time just a disappointing cult.

In Recovery
Unregistered User
(1/13/02 11:48 am)
Reply 		SRF Manifesto
Re: the following quote:
“Hence every SRF student should understand and respect the significance of the link of SRF Gurus--Jesus Christ, Bhagavan Krishna, Mahavatar Babaji, Lahiri Mahasaya, Sri Yukteswar, and Paramahansa Yogananda--with whom all SRF students are connected by affiliation with Self-Realization Fellowship."

Thanks a million, xxxxxxxxxxxx. Your reply was is very helpful and comforting.

On closer examination of the quote, I have noticed that it doesn't explicitly state that SRF is the exclusive organization through which a person can be affiliated with the great Gurus. It simply states that SRF students are affiliated with the Gurus through their SRF membership.

Somehow I read into these words some kind of SRF exclusivity claim. Did anyone else do the same?

As an isolated quote, this passage could be interpreted as neutral OR as claiming exclusive rights to the Gurus' blessings. It could go either way. I'm wondering if there are quotes elsewhere that state explicity what might be implied in the above quote.

Edited by: srfwalrus at: 4/16/02 8:27:21 pm
AumBoy
Registered User
(1/13/02 8:58 pm)
Reply 		Re: Is This the SRF Manafesto?
Quote:
"Your loyalty is to me, not to an organizaton."
This has been incredibly helpful for me.

Dakota
Unregistered User
(1/14/02 2:05 am)
Reply 		Original Writings
Dear xxxxxxxxxxxxx,

One of the things I have not liked has been the changing of the writings by SRF. As I have posted on my web site
yogananda-dif.org, of all the monuments to Yogananda there is not one library where one can go and see all the writing from the beginning. Since Yogananda said the writings would be the Guru, I feel this is a grave oversight.

I am in the process of gathering as many of the original writings to put them into a library so all will have the advantage of reading the original themselves. We do not need to do more editing on the writings. We need to get the original writings out to the people so they can make up their own minds. I too have many of the early lessons and would love to compare notes with you.

I have every version of the AY and am putting them on CD's. I am then having the computer do a comparison on the changes which I will be publishing in the future. I will also be doing a cross index on all books thought out time. This is a lot to do and it keep me very busy.

It you chose to connected please e-mail me at yogana@ix.netcom.com or your can go through my web site.

Edited by: srfwalrus at: 4/16/02 8:28:23 pm
Ari
Unregistered User
(1/18/02 9:34 am)
Reply 		A different perspective
Hi everyone,

I am a new devotee of Yogananda, and a yogi on the path of the Buddha for the past twelve years. I was a novice monk (Buddhist) for a short time in the Southeast Asian Buddhist tradition, have been on many intensive retreats, and would like to briefly share some things that may or may not be helpful. Please forgive me if my comments are out of place, or if you find them irrelevant. I offer them only out of love for those truth seekers here.

In the Buddhist tradition, monks and nuns have always been, and always are, free to take robes and dis-robe at their own whim. You do not need to commit to any period of time, and you are not looked down upon for disrobing. The path of the layman, and the path of the monk are both considered paths to enlightenment. They are also both considered paths to ignorance - it just depends on the heart of the person practicing. To have taken robes at all is considered wonderful merit and a sign of approaching liberation. It is something to be thankful for, even if only done for a few months (as in my case).

From the Buddhist point of view, anyone who has been closely connected with the teachings of a master such as Buddha or Yogananda, are close, very close to achieving liberation. And, the path is not considered to be linear. There is progression forwards and back, and sometimes what appears to be backwards turns out to be forward.

Once, the Buddha was asked by a disciple about a monk in another order, the yogi asked the Buddha "is that sannyasi headed for enlightenment?" The Buddha replied "the only way to know is to get to know him and to watch his actions and reactions and to learn what you can of his heart. If his actions accord with what the wise have said, and what the wise would approve of, and if his actions lead to increasing skillfulness and abandonment of the ego, then he is on the path."

Another thing I have learned is that there are as many ways to God as there are people. Some people only need mantra and breath combined to achieve enlightenment (as in some Buddhist traditions), with this alone I was taught to perceive the light, the sound and infinite space (I'm not claiming enlightenment by the way, this is just a transitory state of Samadhi). Some Hindu yogis practice Kriya, some do Kechari with their Kriya (by practice or spontaneously) and some don't. (Kechari is practiced in other yogas as well.) I have met several illumined teachers in India and here in the U.S. and all have achieved varying degrees of the state of Truth through different paths. Even Yogananda learned Kriya from teachers who were not in the SRF line of gurus. This is plainly revealed in AY and Mejda. All of these teachers helped him along. Notice, he jumped from teacher to teacher - even leaving Sri Yukteshwar at first! Patanjali's Sutras offer a whole slew of objects to concentrate on, and if that isn't enough, concludes by saying that anything the yogi finds easy to concentrate on should be the object of his attention. I guess I offer this to say that even if someone were to take Kriya from you, the Infinite would find another way to show you his love. Believing that only Kriya done in a very specific fashion will lead to liberation is as much a limiting view as thinking you "are the body". Only more and more expansive and accepting consciousness will lead to liberation.

One last thing - How do monastics and former monastics of SRF view teachers like Swami Premananda and his disciples, or others who were authorized to teach by Yogananda? These teachers appear to me as lights in the world, have any considered turning to them for guidance?

I would like at last to clarify why I have signed up for the lessons: the lessons are powerful. Nowhere else have I seen such complete WRITTEN meditation instructions. I tune out the SRF reinforcing statements and tune into the truth in the techniques that are taught. In the Buddhist world, the techniques are taught in person, but you have to be near a teacher to really learn. The lessons make it possible to learn from a distance. Although the states attained correspond with the Buddhist states of Samadhi, the Buddhists tend to offer sparse, but potent teachings about how to enter Samadhi, and the rest is left for a the Yogi to figure out in meditation. But, some need more detail, and the lessons offer that. If this kind of detail is preserved and passed along by a person who has achieved even the lowest state of Samadhi, then the way will remain open - whether inside or outside of an organization. The Buddha taught that the way to liberation would remain open, even if one could only resort to reading his teachings. With practice, everything is revealed to the devotee - as God is the guru of those without a physical guru, or the guru him/herself aids unseen.

Thanks for listening, and thanks for the sharing that you do here. You have helped this yogi to keep his eyes open.

With lovingkindness and peace,

Ari

Been there
Unregistered User
(1/18/02 10:15 am)
Reply 		Ari's post
Wonderful post -- thanks. Yes it is wonderful that the Lessons offer detailed meditation instructions and this is the beauty of Yogananda's work. Unfortunately many are not able to be as kind and liberal to themselves as you are. Thus they enter into the craziness that SRF has become.
The fortunate thing is that many of us have been able to begin tuning in to our own hearts instead of what SRF leadership believes is a divinely guided organization. And this can only lead to good, because as you said, the divine will always find a way to our hearts - to love and be loved by each of us.

willy1080
Registered User
(1/18/02 10:40 am)
Reply 		Re: Ari's post
Truly a very beautiful post !!
A breath of freshness and simplicity :)

Can you share more

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