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dawnrays Registered User (1/5/04 9:26 am) Reply	Re: Kriya and devotion... or "blissed out".... Snake, Sounds tempting sweetie, but, yea, I've been married for 15 years and have two kids (wanted more but it was not to be!) I'm also a whole ocean away from you (alas!) I live in Washington State... Yes yes yes. Alot of people critisize others for posting on the Walrus, but being Master's great success story (as well as being thoroughly fed up with srf party line) I really feel inspired to post. One of the great lessons I learned from Master is never to put anything ahead of God. Now if srf is interfering or destroying your spiritual life, it is your DUTY to leave and speak up... I had a great many obsessive compulsive type disorders over the years. In my youth I was obsessed with food and became bulemic. I was never overweight, but like alot of women in this country, I judged my beauty and worth from the outside-in and could never see myself as beautiful (even though most people think I'm rather good looking, not to brag). Most of our distortions regarding food, sex, drugs and alchohol are for a desire for bliss and unconditional love. The lessons are very clear on this and there is no mystery about it. My hardest habit to give up was actually smoking, so of course my food tastes better now. My switch to vegetarian and holistic foods also helped. I don't want to go to far off on animal rights, but anybody who eats the tainted meat and eggs in this country is really putting themselves at a health risk. If you do eat meat and eggs, please try to buy free range products. The animals raised on factory farms are miserable and mistreated. They are full of hormones, antibiotics (as their quarters are so cramped and filty they are prone to disease). I am still very, very sensitive to suffering and emotions, but it DOES NOT drive me nuts like it used to. I no longer feel the need to escape from these feelings (which are actually good feelings, we should notice suffering, not ignore it). I needed to develop a more detached and stronger attitude towards myself and others and I did... Hope that answers...
etzchaim Registered User (1/5/04 9:40 am) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya I think it's very important to separate Kriya from the SRF experience. All of my knowledge and experience, prior to finding this board has been outside of SRF, and many of the problems people seem to be experiencing are endemic to SRF. Sayitaintso's comment about believing in a fairy tale is very apropo, Dawnray comments on making more progress once she was outside of the 'cult mind-set' and Ugizralrite positively rebelled against sticking with the 'program', to his benefit, by making sure that his life remained in balance. The issue is Kriya in a cult atmosphere, and Kriya as a tool within a balanced life and spiritual practice. I have to say that NEVER has Kriya been taught to me as a means of burning off karma for my next life. The emphasis has always been on living in the present life, improving this life - if any karma is to be burned or balanced out, it's so that this life can be lived better. Serenity, I have had similar experiences with Kundalini. At first it was only going up into my second chakra. Over time, it's reached up to my heart chakra. I have a major blockage somewhere between my heart chakra and my throat chakra - Astrologically, it works out to a Mercury problem, because all the illness and weak points I've experienced are all consistently ruled by Mercury. It affects me most when I'm trying to bring the energy down the back. I have found a few things that have helped. Any kind of reduction of tension is extremely beneficial, to begin with (doing kriya because if I didn't I would get bad karma would be a definate no no...). Depth Psychology with Astrological work (lots of Greek myths and how those archetypes work their way out in my personality) and some really, really hard inner work to deal with an extremely disfunctional childhood and much effort to see my blind spots, projections, and where I'm holding onto self-destructive patterns or fear, where my negative childhood (and some past life) experiences have damaged me and how best to heal from that damage. I've found that blocks can be caused as much by fear and 'punishment' patterns from childhood - or subtle messages we get that we are 'bad' or 'not good enough'. Several blockages have been removed just from bringing some of this into consciousness and letting them go, then finally healing.
SsSsSnake Registered User (1/5/04 10:19 am) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya Needthestar. When i was doing some Muktananda and Chidvalasanda stuff mainly using SO Ham mantra I used to get a lot of sexual stuff mainly I think because it tended to focus on the shakti feminine energy, using Hong Sau is totally different for me and puts my energy in my head not my lower chakras hers a link to a site explaining it home.istar.ca/~tantric/krya.html
SsSsSnake Registered User (1/5/04 10:29 am) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya Not just kriya can get you into sound and light see link> ">vm.mtsac.edu/~dlane/kstat.html
SsSsSnake Registered User (1/5/04 10:30 am) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya hmmmm try this one then clck on the Kirpal Statistic link vm.mtsac.edu/~dlane/rsdeb.html
needthestar Registered User (1/5/04 11:01 am) Reply	Taylor Fitted Kriya I think Etz. has hit on something important. If I may: Those that have tailored Kriya (such as UG, DR, and Snake) to themselves, seem to have had a more positive experience. While YB and SIIS seem to have been suffocating under the rules and regs of a tight do's and don'ts regime. Does that sound fair? So one could argue that Kriya taught under any organization, be it SRF, Ananda, Solar Logos etc. might be considered restricting until the individual finds his or her "comfort zone" within their own practice? The problem being that an organization such as SRF does not like the individual to deviate. Maybe like a new pair of shoes. The size might be right, but until it is worn and walked in, only then does it "fit just right"? May I ask?: What constitutes a "blockage" of the chakra? Is it emotional, or is a physical pressure or both? I don't quite follow - would appreciate clarification. Snake - Thanks for more great links. Without getting too personal, would you say that practices like Hong Sau or Kriya REDUCE your sexual appetite? Does the energy or focus stay in your head after the practice...or does it quickly fade away when the practice is through? Have you noticed if Kriya has made you more a recluse or withdrawn - leaving you to desire more and more meditation time? Does this make sense? Thanks! Edited by: needthestar at: 1/5/04 11:03 am*
needthestar Registered User (1/5/04 11:41 am) Reply	More Questions for YB YB - you feel that Kriya dulled your mind. Can you describe this feeling? Was it like having a head-cold, or having a blanket over your head - as if you were 2-3 seconds behind actual thought? Does this make sense? Did you notice that this dullness ended with quiting Kriya practice? Has any other meditation methods "sharpened" your mind? I'd like to address this quote if I may: "YellowBeard feels that if one were to visualize a mouse sitting on one's shoulder nibbling on cheese with focused meditative awareness, that would provide the same effects as Kriya. The things we visualize in Kriya are just that -- things we are imagining. In Buddhist Tantric practices (non-sexual), one is taught to visualize all sorts of funny things just like with Kriya, but even more so. The effects are the same. But of course what you are taught to believe will effect what type of experiences you may have. People talk about seeing particular saints, chakra lights, etc. This is simply stuff that our minds generate. The shamans of native cultures see "plant spirits" and the religious images of their cultures. In other words, if you do any repetitive, focused mental exercise long enough, you will begin to hallucinate. Also, one is messing with their brain chemistry and this is why people hear noises and see lights. Combine that with your hallucinations and you get an "artificial" religious experience of no real value. Many people get "blissed-out" at times through these practices. But we can do that with heroin too. Both these approaches have no real spiritual value even though they may feel good." It seems that there are those that have had experiences with Kriya which went beyond what their imaginations could construct. From what I understand if one meditates with expectations, such as meeting a saint etc., then the meditation will fail. Surely you yourself had some slight hope of seeing or hearing something, but you did not...so why did your imagination not conjure up a mental light show? Why? Do you see what I am driving at? I think I see a contradiction here; that if the Kriyabans mind is making these experiences up, but the experiences seem beyond the Kriyabans capacity to imagine such things. Wouldn't the images play out exactly as they had imagined - such as a movie? Yet, lacking the detail some experiences bring forth? And those that do wish for lights etc. have nothing....so how is Kriya at fault here? Did you have expectations of Kriya - such as described above? Would love to hear your thoughts! Edited by: needthestar at: 1/5/04 2:21 pm
SerenityNow7 Registered User (1/5/04 1:13 pm) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya Etzchaim, what you say makes a lot of sense to me. I too have been working at these blocks from many angles, psychological, even homeopathically! It's encouraging to me that you have had success in removing them. The archetypes have always been fascinating to me and quite powerful - I've always found Persephone interesting. I think the energy got stuck abouts the third chakra for me...what planet does that correspond to? I'd like to hear more about these planetary correspondences. I haven't deliberately tried to move the energy/kundalini since thinking that once the time is right it will move again. Needthestar, to answer how the block felt to me. In both cases I was meditating and quite unexpectedly there was a powerful feeling of energy (electrical?) in the spine with a feeling of upward movement and blinding light. I assume there is a block because it was moving up and then just stopped. The second time it happened about six years later it started where it had stopped the first time, and progressed about a three inches or so and halted again. It was slightly frightening as well, so it is possible I stopped it myself even though I tried to relax into it. And reminiscent of something Etzchaim has said, both times this occurred were during times of personal breakthrough in my life.
needthestar Registered User (1/5/04 2:00 pm) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya SN7 - I'm sorry, did these blocks occur while practicing Kriya or another meditation technique? So that was something you physically felt and emotional trauma can cause these blocks. Thank you for clarifying. Much clearer now. Is it safe to assume that blocks can be caused by past life trauma as well? Sorry if I seem overly ignorant about this technique, because I am. Other than counting breathes and Hong Sau I have no more meditation experience. Great stuff. NTS Edited by: needthestar at: 1/5/04 2:03 pm
etzchaim Registered User (1/5/04 2:11 pm) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya Serenity, the third chakra is Mars. The Persephone archetype would certainly relate to this. She was raped by the god of the underworld and forced to live in the underworld for half the year. That would indicate you are relating to a repression of your individual freedom (Mars is the expression of individuality - it's self-oriented, and has to do with how you get what you want in life). Rape is, of course, a Mars related issue (as well as Pluto, which would be the back of the third chakra, being the co-ruler of Scorpio - Aries would be the front). You would have to investigate your personality and life experiences to figure out how your individuality, or instinctual self-expression, was 'pushed underground', so to speak, and how to release that in a way that works for you. You could also have some repressed anger. If your family or personal pattern is to denigrate an open expression of anger, that could be causing the blockage. Depression or lethargy and not caring are symptoms that show this is happening, or using "kindness and concern" to express the anger, as a passive aggressive person would, is also an indication. Mars is often blocked in women, by the way. We're supposed to be nurturing and loving creatures, living for others. The blocked Martial energy causes a good deal of havoc, in reality.
etzchaim Registered User (1/5/04 2:25 pm) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya "Not just kriya can get you into sound and light see link" Ss... the sounds and lights are experienced universally by people and have nothing to do with a specific practice. They represent internal levels. The first is the humming sound, that sounds like bees. It precedes the seeing of the light of the Third Eye. You will get a donut shaped white light first (Astral), then a blue light (Causal), then the star will appear (this is a doorway, so to speak). When you can find the point in the star, and go through it, you will leave the Causal plane and be in Cosmic Consciousness. These seem to be universal, as I have the same "light" experiences doing various forms of meditation, including the Jewish Kabbalistic practices,who speak of the Causal blue light as the shining blue Sapphire at the base of God's Throne. Seeing actual images is a bit different, because our own beliefs and experiences will shape them. It's all the same initial Light, but as it filters into our personal space, it will take the form of something that is either in our environmental space or something that we have a connection to. On a few occasions it's actually a higher Astral or Causal experience, but most visions are more subjective. There seems to be a qualitative feeling difference. Like I've had visions of saints (one was with a group of Seiks, and I had a vision of their Guru) and I've also had a visit from my Guru from my last lifetime. The visit was decidedly different from the vision. It was not an image but an actual being - definately outside of my head, but not physical, either. The vision of the Seik Guru was more like a gift - a connection to the group through the Guru (the grandson of the Guru who I saw) who lead the meditation. It was definately not a visitation, more like a picture. Edited by: etzchaim at: 1/5/04 2:58 pm
needthestar Registered User (1/5/04 2:43 pm) Reply	Another Gem From Etz I just raided the fridge at the "Kriya, Just The Facts Please" thread. I thought these notes by Etzchaim help buttress this thread a great deal and would be convenient/concise for anyone else following this thread. If you've seen these notes already, sorry - but the next reader may not have. Her comments on keeping a balanced perspective on Kriya are refreshing: 1/4/04 2:37 pm In my personal bio, I wandered more when I was younger. Kriya cleared me of a lot of anger, and continues to be a useful tool in my current issues (which are more about foundation building) but I would never rely on just the technique. I agree with Dawnrays in another thread, where she says that Kriya is also physical. Being a Pranayama technique, it would seem to bridge a gap between the mental, or the emotional, and the physical. However, there's much more to the technique than just doing the technique. I find that once I can understand a chakra and the issues involved in it, I'm more conscious about how to bring the energy into everyday life, through planting it, or breathing it through, a chakra with all it's symbolic collection of energies. I also rely on other methods that Have Worked For Me (emphasis on the relativity of this), like Depth Psychology-based Astrology, Personal Myth and Dream analysis, Hatha Yoga and chakra work and working at reminding myself that I need to ground myself more than bring the energy up to the spiritual. Getting at deep physchological issues seems to be more the key to having lots of things work better for me, including the Kriya. I can relate to someone having difficult experiences with Kriya, but can't relate to someone having no experiences with it whatsoever, and I can relate to understanding it purely in negative material terms, like it's just hyperventilation. I always have stopped breathing it if I was getting uncomfortable and while I've experienced personally the benefits (and some of the pitfalls), it's difficult to express the experience in a way that people who have not had similar experiences can understand, and nearly impossible to describe to someone who wishes to not understand (meaning understand from my perspective, because they, of course, do understand from their perspective). and vice-versa, I suppose. I do think some inititial 'devaluing of Kriya' needs to be done, particularly for peole in SRF who have been told that it's an 'elexir'. It is really is just a technique, and techniques can only do a certain amount of the work. As far as techniques go, it's quite good, though, but there are quite a few other factors involved in becoming conscious, or more conscious, at least, and Kriya is only one set of techniques. One of it's great values, I've found, though, is that it's adaptable to many symbol systems. Breath and consciousness, rotation around an "Axis Mundi" that has within it centers of nerve/mind 'mass-energy' transformers of sort (those would be the chakras/sephirot) that link the world of creation with the physical, manifested world. These are universal patterns - too universal to be hogwash, and I've seen my own progress. It's important to understand that individuation and development of the self is an ongoing and sometimes very arduous, sometimes very scary process. Kriya is a very fundamental tool. It works with a very primal energy and can move a good deal of consciousness down the axis of our minds, in the lower nerve centers, and bring unconsciousness up to the light of day, but it's only one of the many tools we each should be working with. Kriya might even be a bad tool for someone to be using at a given time in their lives, or it might need to be balanced by something else. Another issue I've seen, is sometimes we are not bringing the energy back down, perhaps because we think the 'spiritual' is better, or we have a judgmental attitude to the physical - it's Satans lair, so to speak, and we denigrate it and have issues with it. This way we become ungrounded and we need to balance that out by wallowing in the earth plane for a while, and not being spiritual, till we have our bearings back, but then we end up being more spiritual because we, hopefully, have gotten over the prejudice against the earth plane that caused our problem to begin with. The bias against the earth plane in our culture and we've separated mind from matter, or the spiritual and the physical, and called one 'good' and one 'bad', so a repression may have occured of just basic, and perhaps very spiritual needs for physical relationship, or contacts with other humans, or anger (then we may become 'passive aggressive', may get depressed, etc.), or whatever is being repressed.
etzchaim Registered User (1/5/04 2:55 pm) Reply	Re: Taylor Fitted Kriya "What constitutes a "blockage" of the chakra? Is it emotional, or is a physical pressure or both? I don't quite follow - would appreciate clarification." NtS, the best way I can describe a blockage is as a block in the self that prevents the expression of the Self. In me, blockages have manifested on all the different levels - physically, emotionally, mentally and probably spiritually. They're more like matrices. I identified them literally through breathing Kriya because I started to feel the energy stop and spread in certain areas, or go off to one side. When I started to use symbolic and mythic systems that related to these areas, that was when I was able to make the connections to my actual life. There are also underfed chakras, you might say. The New Age bookstore in Ann Arbor once had one of those Chakra photography gadget thingies (sorry for the technical jargon) and my base Chakra was a little red spot, just barely there. At least it was red! That clued me into the fact that I have very little energy directed toward my earth life and ever since then I've been trying to open that up, get energy down there and strengthen it. As I do this, I get more and more grounded and more able to manifest my goals. My heart chakra was grey and spread out all over the place, so, I need to contain that area and give it more structure and healing to open wounds. That's where I'm wounded the most and it relates to my base chakra in that I'm an artist, so an injured Venus (painting) chakra does not create a stable art career, hence the bad foundation. I'm not sure which caused which, but it really doesn't matter, because both need to be worked on simultaneously. Much of the Venus problem shows up in my relationship with my mother (mentally ill and very jealous and unsupportive of any creative ability I had), so I've had to do a whole lot of work in ending my extended adolescent rebellion against a crazy, repressive mother, let myself heal, and stop the internal 'mother' from continuing the process my physical mother started (all of this refers to past-life issues, as well). I'm certain that the Venus issue caused the blockage, because Mercury is how we express our talents, so there was not ability to express going on. This manifested literally in not being able to paint for quite a long time. That might help you in understanding. The Kriya was fundamental in helping me to identify the blockages, but Kriya in itself is not set up to do the ground work of actually handling the problems. It does a good job of 'exposing' the subconscious patterns, but isn't helpful with the details or the actual work. It can help push through the problem, or clear out old stuff, but we hold onto patterns that, until we are ready to let go, the Kriya will only make worse. We need to really work at identifying what we are locked into and what the details are for us individually and do the psychological or physical healing work to remove them. Kriya can't tell us "Hey, you are acting like a raving luny because your mother always undermined any effort you made to be creative and questioned your ability to make your own decisions". The blockage is like a 'blind spot' that consciousness and often painful realizations, need to be brought to. One of the things that IS helpful where the Kriya is concerned, is, once you have identified where the issue is, consciously bringing some of the bliss into that area will help shed some light. Passively breathing Kriya and expecting it to do all the work will most likely lead to a continuing of the problems, their growth, even, and an escape into the bliss-state, for no purpose but to escape. It has to be used. I use massage/acupressure and Hatha Yoga, as well as diet to deal with a good amount of the physical stuff. Fortunately, I don't have any real serious medical issues, most of the physical manifestations have been muscular in those areas and, with the Mercury/Venus blockage, massage and meridian work (acupuncture/acupressure) helps quite a bit with the upper respiratory problems. My problem is more stored toxins, at this point - which could have turned into serious illness in the future. We all have to identify our own issues. There's no way to create a cookie-cutter system to do this and quite a lot of it is self-analysis and really, really humbling $:\$ Edited by: etzchaim at: 1/5/04 3:14 pm
needthestar Registered User (1/5/04 3:18 pm) Reply	Re: Taylor Fitted Kriya Etz. - fascinating. That helps, thank you. I had never really given the chakras much thought until reading this thread. I never paid much attention as I figured one just needed the "spiritual eye"....ala SRF. Does this electrical surge start from the base chakra and run up the spine or the other direction or both? I've heard of the female and masculine energies..that spiral in opposite directions...is this the same energy? I don't expect you to actually give out the Kriya technique on this board, nor would I want you to, but I have came across a technique the claims to be "paralleled" with Yogananda's Kriya. It involves squeezing the buttocks before the inhalation. Is this a shared aspect of Kriya among different Kriya styles, or is it unique? It also involves breathing the "life force" in and out - and observing the chakras. I don't want to get into too much detail, but wondering if this sounds similar? thanks for sharing NTS Edited by: needthestar at: 1/5/04 3:21 pm*
YellowBeard420 Slow Down (1/5/04 4:23 pm) Reply	Re: More Great Stuff > NeedTheStar wrote: "I have a question for both YB and SIIS ... Do you feel that rigidity might have hampered your efforts? In other words you followed the directions to the 't', but lost the 'spirit' of the practice in the end?" YellowBeard feels that he followed the directions of Kriya so carefully because of his great faith in the practice, so he doesn't feel that his spirit was laking. Yogananda always compared yoga to science, so in this light YellowBeard followed the technique like a science experiment. But devotion was part of the experiment as well, and YellowBeard gave his all. In fact this is why YellowBeard is so upset over the whole affair -- he gave all his love only to have it snatched away, and YellowBeard received a boot to the head as a thank you. > NeedTheStar: "While YB and SIIS seem to have been suffocating under the rules and regs of a tight do's and don'ts regime." YellowBeard can only speak for himself here, but this may have factored into it. Punk Yogi and YellowBeard had a conversation on this where Punk felt that this was the problem for lack of Kriya success. This is a fair observation. It is a good analysis that NeedTheStar made about most of the posters here that have experienced success with Kriya have loosened up the rules to make Kriya more easy to fit into like a shoe, so to speak. This does seem like the more healthier approach, and these posters do seem to have not gotten so "burned" by SRF by doing this. But we have to ask what we mean by success with Kriya, which YellowBeard thinks that NeedTheStar actually brought up early in the thread. The posters that talk about success with Kriya speak about blissful feelings, visions and chakra activity. It's important to note that they never talk about Self-realization. But seeking Self-realization isn't necessarily the "right" thing for everyone to do. Perhaps Kriya is a good tool for what these posters are using it for. > NeedTheStar: "you feel that Kriya dulled your mind. Can you describe this feeling? Was it like having a head-cold, or having a blanket over your head - as if you were 2-3 seconds behind actual thought?" It felt like having a part of the brain cut out. Certain ways of thinking worked fine, but in other areas the mind seemed incapable of functioning. Instead of a feeling like a blanket was covering the entire head, it was like just parts were covered and the rest just worked normal as usual. It was like looking out at the world and not seeing everything -- a type of mental tunnel vision. > NeedTheStar: "Did you notice that this dullness ended with quiting Kriya practice?" After several months, it slowly cleared up. > NeedTheStar: "Has any other meditation methods 'sharpened' your mind?" Practicing Choiceless Awareness as described earlier has sharpened the mind. Not in the mathematical type of sense, but in the way of being more alert to a fuller spectrum of activity within and outside the mind. > NeedTheStar: "Surely you yourself had some slight hope of seeing or hearing something, but you did not...so why did your imagination not conjure up a mental light show? YellowBeard does not know. He doesn't think that everyone experiences a mental light show. This is why he describes it as messing with brain chemistry, it affects people differently. But altering the brain chemistry is not necessarily a bad thing. It can be just as much a good thing as a bad thing. Here's an important excerpt of 3 fairly short paragraphs from an article entitled "Meditating may be hazardous to your health" by Sandy Brundage to help explain what I mean: -------------------- "A lot of people do experience negative side effects," says Dr. Maggie Phillips, the director of the California Institute of Clinical Hypnosis and a licensed psychologist in Oakland who teaches workshops to colleagues around the world on the proper applications of relaxation therapies. "I've had people that went to these five- to eight-day-long retreats, and they were practically basket cases when they came out the other end. And they're told, "You just have to be more patient.' A lot of spiritual teachers don't know how to look at the internal dynamics and how they interact with types of relaxation and meditation." Just as some people are allergic to penicillin, some people react badly to meditation. Billed as a "one size fits all" technique for self-improvement and even healing, meditation is packaged in a hundred different ways. Mantra meditators chant a phrase with numbing repetition. Others practice walking meditation, or empty-mind meditation, sweeping the mind clean of thought. The harmful effects aren't limited to one specific technique or even long retreats. Those effects can include facial tics, insomnia, spacing out, and even psychotic breakdowns. Dr. Margaret Singer, clinical psychologist emeritus at Berkeley, with research partner Dr. Janja Lalich, collected case histories from 70 clients seeking treatment for problems that began during meditation practice. Their research presents several examples of these symptoms and notes that prior to meditating, none of the patients had individual or family histories of mental disorders. [San Francisco Weekly, Aug. 28, 2002] -------------------- So we are messing with our brain chemistry. This is not always good as we can see here. We should proceed with caution. The devotional aspects of the guru-disciple relationship can make one look the other way when one starts to experience negative reactions. YellowBeard is mentioning this because that's what he did. The two strongest proponents of Kriya here are probably Etzchaim and Punk Yogi. It's a rough call, there's some close others, but YellowBeard would have to say Etz and Punk. Now Yellowbeard is just making an observation here, he is not judging. Here's a word for word quote by each: > Etzchaim (1/5/04): "the third chakra is Mars. The Persephone archetype would certainly relate to this. She was raped by the god of the underworld and forced to live in the underworld for half the year." > Punk Yogi (12/19/03): "People with moon in Leo are naturally playful and love the stage." Now before anyone gets too excited about YellowBeard posting those quotes, bear in mind that he has not made any comments suggesting anything about these statements. We're examining Kriya scientifically here in this thread. We need to look at what happens to people after they practice Kriya. Yellowbeard is not saying that this is a good or bad sign, it's up to each reader to decide for themselves.
SsSsSnake Registered User (1/5/04 4:57 pm) Reply	Re: More Great Stuff Needthestar. Just for the record Bro what star sign are you? You remind me of times when Ive got into something and want to analyze and discover as much imformation as I could about it.Such enthusiasm is commendable,sometimes I used to (and maybe still do) spend so much time actually gathering imformation about a particular subject that by the time I came around to actually getting into it proper I had burnt out But power to your elbow bro.
SerenityNow7 Registered User (1/5/04 5:17 pm) Reply	Re: Results From Kriya Etzchaim, fascinating. From what I know of my astrological chart Mars is definitely a problem planet. The aspects of the Persephone myth that spoke to me most are about dealing with one's shadow side. I've been fortunate enough not to have experienced rape, but I have experienced much psychological "repression" if you will and my life's journey seems to be about working to be free of it. Beyond that it gets much too personal for me to discuss. But it is no mystery to me where all of this comes from. Dealing with it is another matter entirely though! NTS, something more for you about the blockages. What I described happened to me during regular non-kriya meditations. That's one reason I'm so curious like you as to what a technique that actually focused on the spine would do! I've had energy work done (reiki type things) and it's always quite obvious which parts of my body soak up the energy and which areas remain dead feeling by comparison. Shows up the blocks quite readily.
needthestar Registered User (1/5/04 5:21 pm) Reply	Words to YB YB - thanks for the post. I was afraid you'd think I was circling the wagons. You're right. Kriya has been handed to us as a science, recipe, instruction booklet etc. I agree. So I understand your approach now, and agree somewhat. I know this is subjective, but some of the best meals come from recipes that have been added to intuitively. Little extra salt or less spices than the recipe originally called for...perfected by personal taste. From what I'm reading it sounds like this is the best and possibly the healthiest approach to Kriya. SRF can not give individual instructions to each member as Yogananda once did for his direct group of students. So...the result is mass mailing of a rigid lesson....and no body wants to fail the lessons, fail SRF, fail Yogananda and most importantly fail God, the host of eternal happiness. I did not last long with the lessons. I just couldn't connect with them, they seemed...cold. But for some, that works. I like this quote: "But seeking Self-realization isn't necessarily the "right" thing for everyone to do. Perhaps Kriya is a good tool for what these posters are using it for." Success - good point. No one has mentioned the ultimate goal - Self Realization, and in all fairness I don't think a Self Realized person would be posting on Walrus. Success is different to each individual and Kriya is a universal tool for different spiritual projects - For Etz., it may be to help her with her chakras, maybe for Dawnrays it's a moment of peace in a sometimes very cruel world, maybe for UG it's to reach beyond what he sees here and now with his physical eyes (I don't mean to speak for anyone)...and all of this falls under the frame work (or circus tent as some may see it) of SOMEDAY reaching Self-Realization. It seems that most folks here are not very hung up on Self Realization - here and now. I would have argued at one time that they're wasting their time, but now I'd have to say they seem to have an extremely healthy outlook...and that includes you YB. The brain chemistry part is over my head. But if Kriya does change the brain chemistry, as you suggest, then a little could go a long way. So that would mean that a new Kriyaban might need help - or teaching - to harness Kriya properly. Now that might fall under the category of a Guru, would it not? But what to do when one is in a physical, hellish existence and the guru is in a heavenly astral existence? Just a thought, but funny how it's come full circle. Another thought on altering Brain Chemistry: I've never taken any stimulant (drug). Can you compare the two? Drugs versus Kriya? I'm just wondering which really is safer? Too much Kriya can be stopped - even as the meditation is in process, but too much stimulant has to run its course once it's been ingested. Any thoughts based on experience? I'll take a shot at the quotes. I'm guessing the purpose of those quotes might be to show a contradiction. That Kriya, the scientific way to Self Realization, is being garland with pixie dust and moon beams. Although one can't put pixie dust in a test tube nor count the number of angels on a pin head, I think it's the immeasurable the propels all we know...and allows the measurable to exist. For at one time this planet was flat, now it's not. Once the moon was made of cheese, but now it's not. So those that seem to be star gazing...may actually be the true scientists...and what we call scientists are just dissecting monkeys. Just a thought. YB, when you look back on Kriya, do you wish it all away? Do you really think it's a total waste of time as Forkhand has suggested? Would you ever in a million years sit down and just try it (kriya) one more time? I've enjoyed you posts. Your challenges have taken me from hating you to loving you....and I think I've grown from those challenges...and laughed my ass off in the process too. thanks NTS Edited by: needthestar at: 1/6/04 6:42 am
needthestar Registered User (1/5/04 5:43 pm) Reply	Re: More Great Stuff Snake - Star Sign? I think the DeathStar. I'm not sure - I'm a Libra, born October 21, 1967. Does that help? Hey, you're not gonna cast a spell on me are you? You're right. After all of these questions it's time to seriously think about applying them...thanks for the levity man! SN7 - All this is very interesting. I'm glad you and Etz. have been talking about it. I deeply admire those that are so in tune with what's going on inside of themselves. Gee, if everyone was like that, what a much better world this would be.
SayItIsntSo Registered User (1/5/04 8:21 pm) Reply	Re: Deviations *Quote:* SRF can not give individual instructions to each member as Yogananda once did for his direct group of students. So...the result is mass mailing of a rigid lesson....and no body wants to fail the lessons, fail SRF, fail Yogananda and most importantly fail God, the host of eternal happiness. As I said on an earlier post, I received Kriya when I was 20 from Daya Mata, and I studied with Baktananda in Hollywood. I also studied the lessons and applied them to my life for many years. I had no problems with the lessons, and read them frequently--almost at every mediation time. I seemed to find a lot of answers in them... I used to think all the questions at Convocation could be answered if one read the lessons! Anyways, I don't think getting Kriya or having a direct disciple guide you, means much. Look at me! It didn't get me anywhere "special." I had lots of "in's" back in the day, I can tell you. I even knew people outside of SRF who were "friends" with PY. Pictures to prove it and lots of stories no one ever tells. All good, mind you! My lessons were some of the originals as are my books and magazines. I still have everything, but its all in a plastic box in the rafters. I also have the gold/silver and copper bangle in my jewery box, that I paid $700. The most difficult thing was taking it off my wrist. Though I left SRF, and I've read some weird things about Daya Mata and other brothers here, I can only go by my own experiences and be truthful. I once had a Christmas dinner with Daya Mata and a handful of others. It was so wonderful. I was only in my 20s, and unaware of the specialness of the invitation. When she took my hands I felt peace, though I wasn't seeking peace. I was just a kid, you know, and she touched me... I never got goofy about her appearances, but I never forgot that meeting or the time I took Kriya from her. Say what people will, but she was a very peaceful woman and I enjoyed her presense. Brother Baktananda was a wonderful human being...and maybe he is a saint. All I know is he was very relaxed and wasn't at all like the SRF monks or devotees I came to know later. He wasn't ridgid at all, not about anything that I can remember--and he was very funny. He used to make us laugh. Anyone who spent time with him, alone, and not in a crowd, will understand, probably, what everyone loved about PY. Very relaxed and made me feel accepted. If I were to talk to anyone it would be to him (if he's still around...maybe he could sort it all out?). Back to Kriya practice. I knew devotees that took the second Kriya, which I never did, not even after 30 years, as I couldn't bear more work at meditation time. But I think some people just wanted to say they had it...that they hadn't mastered the first Kriya. I never saw lights, but I did feel a warmth in the spine. I do remember being very focused and light...and, I suppose an out of body experience. I've really convinced myself it was hypnosis, but who knows? I can't say anything for sure anymore. Whenever I finished Kriya, I felt relieved, and thankful to be able to go back to chanting and meditating and prayer. I had more experiences in mediation than in Kriya practice. Once I had an experience when not even meditating, but at a retreat. It was nothing like I ever experienced. Though I don't practice Kriya now (or anything), I don't regret having practiced it, and I can't say I wouldn't ever practice it again. After four years of being away from SRF there is no doubt I am seeking the hole left by leaving. I can't seem to rally any faith in anything--not the kind of conviction I had in SRF, anyways. But where does one go after SRF? It seems nearly impossible to turn to anything "less." As weren't we to believe everything else was a buggy ride? It's confusing. Maybe because tonight is Yoganada's birthday that I feel wistful? Maybe this is a cross posting...not just about Kriya...sorry. Edited by: SayItIsntSo at: 1/5/04 8:26 pm