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needthestar
Registered User
(1/3/04 8:17 am)
Reply 		Results From Kriya
THIS THREAD IS MY RESPONSE TO THE COMMENTS MADE ON THE THREAD "KRIYA, JUST THE FACTS PLEASE", AND IS DEDICATED TO GETTING TO THE BOTTOM OF THIS TOPIC STARTED BY SN7 (BEFORE IT GOT OFF THE DIRECT TOPIC). THE "LEGITIMACY OF KRIYA" ARGUEMENT IS GETTING OLD - LET'S ATTEMPT TO END IT ONCE AND FOR ALL BY COMPARING AND CONTRASTING KRIYA PARTICIPANTS EXPERIENCES.

When I read a statement like:
"Anyone that has done Kriya Yoga KNOWS for a FACT that it does not do ANYTHING"

It throws up a red flag for me.

That seems to me as extreme as "you will be lost for several incarnations"....is it not?

Anyone? ...or everyone will not benefit? That's a pretty big claim.

"Does not do 'ANYTHING'"? Another Big Claim.

Really?

Absolutely nothing?

How does Forkhand know for a "FACT" that over thousands of years EVERYONE that's done Kriya has NEVER benefited in the least bit?

Why so extreme?

Such comments only make me question Forkhand's motive. Why is he so hell bent on discrediting Kriya?

Is his extreme view rooted in bitterness?

If so, what has caused this bitterness?

Is his extreme view rooted in enlightenment?

If so, how did he obtain enlightenment?

What's the rest of the story here?

I agree with Username: let Punk Yogi give us information... but in all fairness let us hear the personal stories of Username (*please see footnote below) and YB as well.

After all, you both claim that Kriya is a farce and does not work. Based on YOUR PERSONAL EXPERIENCE(not on what you've read or been told) how so?

What did you do before Kriya? Any other meditation techniques?

Where, how and from what organization did you learn the technique?

How many years did you invest in Kriya?

Do you feel you truly concentrated while doing this technique?

Did you follow the technique correctly?

How many Kriyas did you do?

What did you experience while doing Kriya?

How did your life differ after Kriya?

Why did you quit?

Did you learn absolutely nothing?

Do you feel cheated?

Can you prove Kriya does NOT burn Karma NOR allow someone to be enlightened in one lifetime?

(It does seem the burden of proof lies in your laps because you are labeling PYogi, Dawnrays and Etz as fakes and phonies.)

Tell us your experiences.

YB says he was associated with SRF for 5 years so I'm guessing he spent what, 2-3 years (tops) practicing Kriya?

Be honest.

Is that enough time to measure the failure or success of that particular method fairly?....especially considering enlightenment is at stake?

So a very fair question might be:

DID KRIYA FAIL YOU OR DID YOU FAIL KRIYA?

I cannot defend or tear down Kriya as I have not practiced it. I do not endorse that any meditation method is for everyone or a one way ticket to enlightenment, but I cannot believe that one technique is the soul farce of all meditation techniques as you both claim.

Let's put this to rest once and for all....let those that have REALLY practiced tell us how they practiced and what they have personally experienced with the technique (again not what you've read or been told - what you've EXPERIENCED)....then we'll compare results. (please relate any and all information: including any spiritual experiences - they will NOT be perceived as bragging, but are needed for complete evaluation)

Fair Enough?

I am someone who is very interested in your results, so please elaborate as much as you can.

Please ONLY post if you are going to relate YOUR EXPERIENCES...no more long over bloated blathering or 2-3 sentence sniping...just YOUR EXPERIENCES on this thread please.

This thread is a spin off of Username's challenge to Punk Yogi:

"Please outline your life. And point out especially where it is that you think Kriya is "burning your karma" to such a degree that you will reach enlightenment in this lifetime."

I extend that challenge to all that practice Kriya and most importantly THOSE THAT DISCREDIT IT.

Time to put your money where your mouth is:

Who's first?

*PLEASE NOTE* I have misjudged Username. I thought Username had no experience with Kriya Yoga and therefore made Username's statements baseless. Username has contacted me via my inbox and has shared with me that Username HAS EXPERIENCE with Kriya but does not wish to post those experiences here as they are private. Usernames remarks are NOT without merit. - thank you

Edited by: needthestar at: 1/3/04 5:15 pm
SsSsSnake
Registered User
(1/3/04 9:14 am)
Reply 		Re: Results From Kriya
My experiences with Kriya generally causes what seems to be the breath stopping,how long for I dont know because as soon as I realize im not breathing I start again but the immediate feeling is as though one has had a deep deep rest.

When I practiced Shankarandas Style of Kriya I got forcefull pressures on the crown movents up the spine of something a massive electrical charge in the crown area.

Now regarding Hong Sau.I have had very very strong energy experiences from that practice far more so than kriya Ive had feelings of spinning around real fast of massive charges of energy in the brain centre expansive feelings of spaciousnesselectric shock type things feelings of being sucked into a black hole.

prior to this practice i was initiated into the Divine Light tecniques that was in 1972 and had hundreds of experiences of golden balls of lights and caves of light numerous musical instrumnet sound bells conches drums harps choirs thunder oceans.wow when i think about it there has been alot of energetic stuff flying around,My nervous system is very sensitive so maybe thats a lot to do with it although I have put thousands of hours into sitting doing the practices.
To be honest I done know if im any the beter off for all that i mean imstill here now same conciousness as before , abit like watching Guy fawkes night really I guess.

dawnrays
Registered User
(1/3/04 9:58 am)
Reply 		Calmly active and Actively Calm
Well, with all due respect then, Snake, maybe it's time to get on with your life then. It sounds like you have had meditation up the wazoo and from more than one path even. But what have you put into practice? Meditation and action are very closely aligned. It's a "point of reference" as ugize likes to say. Meditation is not the goal or the be all and the end all. It's a starting point for a sane life, that's all.

I really have to take exception with the srf (and other paths do this too, in all fairness) of the "bliss bunny" or "serious spiritual aspirant" even. That is a person who has no particular career ambitions, family or significant other type "distractions" from the "goal". It always annoyed me that people who were meditating and yet active in the world with their families or enjoying their careers and hobbies, were always kind of "tsked tsked" by the "serious devotees" as not being "serious" about meditation and "spiritual life".

The goal is to be "actively calm and calmly active" to quote. It is supposed to complement your lifestyle, not replace it or be used as an escape...

username
Registered User
(1/3/04 10:12 am)
Reply 		Re: Calmly active and Actively Calm
SRF DOES REQUIRE THAT YOU GIVE UP FAMILY, FRIENDS, EVERYTHING BUT KRIYA....... and FOR WHAT? The people in SRF are NOT enlightened. They are just very very ODD. It is apparent to everyone..... even other members.... who think there must be something wrong with them... that the other members act so strange around them.

Trust me.... no one acted that strange BEFORE SRF..... so it must be the kriya.... OR JUST HANGING OUT IN THE SRF ENVIRONMENT.

dawnrays
Registered User
(1/3/04 10:32 am)
Reply 		Re: Calmly active and Actively Calm
OK, first of all, they don't "make you". Yes, there is a very STRONG implication that wouldn't it be better if you gave everything up for the "goal".

It annoys and angers me, particularly when I used to hear things from DM like "those of us who have given God their ALL" or see a renunciant pamphet like "Give my thy heart" and so forth. Yes, it is very, very strongly implied. It's creepy.

I am assuming username, that you were very closely associated with one of the California temples if not MC itself? I started off as a lesson student in Virginia and attended the Washington DC meditation group. The first time I attended the San Diego Temple I was so turned off and annoyed I refused to go back for some time. I did eventually make some friends but it was very hard and quite a few of us were openly critical. After awhile I realized the communication in srf was totally one way and they made every attempt to keep information from coming in. We weren't even allowed to have a bulliten board at the temple. We were also not allowed to announce the group therapy sessions we started at someone's house, pot lucks or anything else. They of course refused to allow us to have these things on temple grounds. Much of this activity was due to the murder/suicide of two prominant members there. I did not personally know them well, but everybody seemed to want to talk.

There are many, many more lesson students and kriyabans than those who attend the temples. Even in DC, during a Center tour once, about 300 people showed up to be initiated. Only about 50 or so people attended our group. The "bliss bunnies" at the temples are actually (thank God) a minority because most people cannot simply put their life on hold indefinitely to do volunteer work for srf.

It is a very sad and bitter thing, I agree, for those who have. I am only of course speaking from my own personal experiences here. My heart certainly goes out to you but it really helps to get down to specifics. Have you found things easier since you've left? Rifts with families and put off career goals can be repaired and realigned.

needthestar
Registered User
(1/3/04 10:54 am)
Reply 		Refocus
Please.

I'd like to keep this thread for Kriya experiences only.

Ssssnake - thanks very much for your input - can you give more details on Kriya?

Dawnrays - please tell us how you have benefited from Kriya - how you got started etc.

Username - SRF is not the topic. What are your personal Kriya experiences?

This thread is already being diluted - OR - very quickly getting to its point.

SsSsSnake
Registered User
(1/3/04 11:37 am)
Reply 		Re: Refocus
What sort of details my friend?

needthestar
Registered User
(1/3/04 12:31 pm)
Reply 		Re: Refocus
I'd love to hear why you decided to try Kriya since other techniques seemed to bring forth certain experiences.

Have you tried any other styles of Kriya besides the Shankarandas Style?

At what age did you start meditating?

How does your Kriya meditations stack up to other techniques...or is it wrong to compare?

Do you regard your Kriya experiences as "bad"?

Would you do Kriya again? (I recall Norman Paulson also decribing the pressure on the crown in his book)

Do you feel that Kriya is a farce passed down through the ages, or just not for you?

Have you seen the Star of David?

I'll take any other comments you'd like to offer.

A deep, sincere thanks for sticking to the topic and for your input.

Peace.



needthestar
Registered User
(1/3/04 1:24 pm)
Reply 		Excellent Comments Saved
Here are some excellent quotes from Eztchaim that cut to the marrow of this topic; providing results of her Kriya practice as it was originally posted on the "Kriya, Just The Facts Thread".

I thought I would repost it here to avoid some of the clutter.

12/26/03 1:36 pm

It's all in the spine
---------------------
I'm trying to figure out how to talk about it.

My practice is divided into several things that have worked for me, not just Kriya. With Kriya proper, I usually become much more centered, it increases the intensity with which I see internally, I'm aware of the flow of energy up and down, and can tell when there I'm being to tense or 'tight'. It produces a bliss state, and probably is a chief cause of many of the realizations I've had, along with a couple of other important factors.

I dove into doing Kriya in my mid 20's. By my early 30's it was making me ungrounded, but I wasn't very grounded to begin with. I was basically living in the apartments I was rehabbing or paying very low rent, working part time at bookstores, making some artwork but not much and doing yoga. That it ungrounded me is not very surprising, I was anyway. I've had to work at opening up my base chakra. Massage, oddly enough, has worked the best, along with Hatha, and work on my earth life - starting with getting over the fear and revulsion I had for some of it, including my own career.

I usually feel more of the flow of energy when I'm bringing it down, which to me indicates that I have trouble grounding, duh, and I'd prefer to hang out in heaven and be blissful in la la land. So I focus on bringing it down with a purpose, and am much more involved in trying to live my earth life, which is currently trying to find a way to make a living with creative work, I have an art degree, and withdraw from being a wage slave, than on having an elaborate spiritual life - I try to meditate twice a day, though I'm more disciplined about the morning one, limit my Kriya to what is comfortable, which can change often, but is never more than 15, for quite some time, and go to a religious service once a week (a bunch of meditating, singing Jews, actually, on Saturday mornings) and do a half hour to an hour of Hatha Yoga daily.

To me, a good part of Kriya, as practice and as philosophy, is keeping myself in balance. The focus on the spine is important, and fundamental to the teaching, from what I can tell. You can add what ever religion or metaphysical/philosophical system you want to it, or not have one at all, perhaps. The more aware I've become of the chakras and the energy in them, through the techniques, but also through study, the more I can tap into what my subconscious is doing and work with it, so it becomes conscious and I can bring issues I have up to the higher levels and understand them better. The rotation of the energy is what pushes this along, and it starts with a little amount being taken up from the seat of the Kundalini and then brought around to all the levels of consciousness, front and back.

I generally find that experiences I have in my spine are related to having done something or thought something, so when I'm doing things that are balancing me out, or whatever, I will feel some kind of movement or burning in the spine or on the right or left hand side of the chakra. When how I'm living is producing less balance, my chakra's shut down and even my muscles in my back will become more rigid, so the energy will not flow as well.

Rigidity appears to be a problem in blocking the flow of energy, and in bringing about self destructive patterns or getting locked into destructive situations. I imagine that if I breathed a lot of Kriya and I had many blockages, it would cause a good deal of trouble, so the physical exercises are very important, as is introspection, and an effort to consciously remove issues, or reactions to things, that form blockages, so I find that the Hatha yoga practice is vital to clear things up. I can't say how Yogananda's energizing exercises affect people, but classical Hatha is really amazing in what it can do.

I think that techniques can only take you so far, but that Kriya is a very useful one, and one of the more balanced and powerful ones, but you have to use it mindfully.

12/27/03 3:33 pm

Serenity, if you want a more hands on group and want to remain within a similar SRF format that isn't quite as Corporately weird, the Ananda group seems to be very good. They are very open about working with individuals using the techniques. My own Temple is in Chicago, so that would be farther away for you, and there's a center in Michigan that is run by another disciple of Yogananda that appears to be good, which I'll check out this summer.


As soon as I feel energy going up in a spiral motion, from left to right or right to left, I immediately stop whatever I'm doing. Going up either side will activate the karma. If you are feeling it going up straight and it is not uncomfortable, then the heat you feel is burning up the karma and blockages. You want that to happen. Anything that is uncomfortable (beyond just feeling heat or movement) should be stopped. You can do this by refocusing on physical things, eating (even meat is used in situations where the kundalini is not controllable). I've found that I go through long periods of just using massage and Hatha Yoga with very simple meditation, like empty mind and hong sau. Also, I spend a good deal of time going around the whole chakra system, one chakra at a time, and focusing on keeping in the center of the spine. That sets up a 'track', so to speak, for future energy patterns, so it tends to go up in the center. The consciousness used in doing this will activate the central channel and the chakras. I can recommend a very good lecture on doing this that you might be able to get through Amazon. It will give you the shapes, colors and bija mantra's that Kriya uses in the chakras. I think it's called "Meditation and the Chakras", but I'll have to look it up. It's from a lecture series that my Guru gave.

The idea is to keep the Kundalini energy slowly going up the center (where it's safe) and rotating so that you can remain balanced and keep progressing. The blockages will push it to one side or the other, so going fast is not the ideal, despite how Kriya is 'marketed'. The heavier karma will burn up first - which is usually what we experience as 'bad' karma. Once you get through the heavier stuff (you can literally feel the blockages in interuptions in the flow of the energy), then making faster progress is easier. Many of the changes I've noticed are really having to do with my level of consciousness and awareness.

If you are moving too fast, it is much more difficult to process new awarenesses, or to handle the fact that you've outgrown your earth life and can't relate to the people around you. Many people run into trouble when their consciousness starts entering into the Astral plane. Most people are completely unaware of any activity there, so when 'voices' are heard, or people 'get visions' or become aware of different and more subtle levels of reality, not being able to process, keep things in perspective (that cannot be emphasised enough) or control and understand what is happening can lead to difficulties and often unhealthy responses. It's important to be able discuss what is happening with someone who has also had experience with higher states of awareness (not many people though...) and to work whatever it is into a stable daily life. This is one of the reasons why a good Guru is valuable.

The other thing I've noticed is that people, because 'new' things are happening to them, feel 'special', when in reality all this is very natural, so they blow themselves and their experiences out of proportion and develop delusions of grandeur, etc., or think that they are enlightened when they are simply just becoming more conscious. This is always a problem in 'religion', and needs to be guarded against with a good amount of introspection, questioning, humility and reality checks.

dawnrays
Registered User
(1/3/04 2:20 pm)
Reply 		Re: Refocus
I have never seen lights or stars. My husband sees them though, sometimes even when he's jogging.

I feel the pressure on the crown and a general sensation of "tingling" over my body after the first few kriyas. For lack of a better description, it often feels like a really good bong hit or a hit of coke (I'm not trying to bring this down, or recommend drugs, but I was VERY fond of coke before I started meditating).

I find a general feeling of relaxation and peace when I meditate.

I started meditating to begin with to quit smoking (at the age of 26 I was desperate and ill from tobacco and recreational drug use.) I was also extremely depressed from the suicide of my father and considering suicide myself. To be perfectlly honest, I have alot of mental health issues in my family and I was afraid of it. I didn't think thier was any hope for me.

I always found that focusing on saints and Masters brings me into a higher vibration and moves me along spiritually. It was many, many years of kriya practice before I actually started recieving results every time I meditated, so in my opinion, pictures, writings and even poetry really helps. I consider myself a bhakti yogi and was very attracted to the loving, non-judmental and accepting vibe of the lessons and of Master. I am a loving person who was not raised in a particularly loving environment, so I just drank it in. It even made alot of the srf stuff alot more forgivable (for a long time).

Anyway, on the bad side, I did find that the regimental style of kriya practice (faithfully, morning and evening and an understanding that you increase kriyas over time for maximum benefit) did not work for me. I never did get past the original 24 kriyas and only occassionally do a longer meditation. Sometimes I do 36. I also find that, being a mother with no particular schedule, I just had to make up my own. I had some premature kundalini experiences due to drugs (karma?) in my youth, so I am very careful about getting my rest and sleep. It is a good idea to stop kriya if you are having kundalini problems (excessive heat, massive kriyas (sometimes feeling like a crawling sensation) over the body, very fast and furious realizations). As Punk Yogi says, it is important to feel grounded at such times. I've even heard that very mundane activities like housework and gardening help. Also, familiar and loving surroundings.

I can't stress the "loving surroundings" enough. It is extremely important for people doing kriya and having problems with it, to be loving towards each other. Sometimes realizations are sudden and frightening. I hate to say it, but it's true. A little love and understanding go a long way and are a MUST with the practice of kriya!

Also worth noting, I do feel like I'm living my life from the "inside out". That is most of my decisions are made from the inner standpoint. Both my husband and I have had precognative dreams and information from meditations. This is a little dramatic, but recently I was very sick (but didn't know it). Due to internal bleeding (unknown to me) my blood oxygen count was one third and my iron level was 2. The normal iron count is between 50 and 60. I had a dream I was "running out of gas" and trying to get to a pump in my car. My husband had a dream that I had died. Mainly due to this weirdness, I had a check up. I immediately was admitted to the hospital for a four pint transfusion and a hysterectomy (the source of the bleeding). All the doctors were amazed I wasn't in a coma (they had the initial blood test done twice, as they couldn't believe it).

Thanks to that intervention, I am here writing and that was about 3 months ago.

needthestar
Registered User
(1/3/04 2:43 pm)
Reply 		Thanks Dawnrays...
very nice. I'm glad you added to the thread, thanks.

I find this very interesting:

"It was many, many years of kriya practice before I actually started recieving results every time I meditated."

Have you done other meditation techniques and can you compare Kriya to?

How does devotion work with Kriya? Do you chant or pray before or after Kriya?

In general, how often do you do Kriya...say like within a weeks time? Daily? 3-4 times a week? etc.

Thanks for sharing.

SsSsSnake
Registered User
(1/3/04 3:06 pm)
Reply 		Re: Thanks Dawnrays...
Needthestar

I will answer your questions,I need a little time to address them all and my son has mt connection this Sat and sun so I will reply on Sun night.before if I can.

SsSsSnake
Registered User
(1/3/04 3:29 pm)
Reply 		Re: Thanks Dawnrays...
One quick reply to one question.

I took Kriya initiation in SRF about 7 years ago before I tried the Shankaranda style.

The reason I was interested in Kriya despite my numerous explosions of light and sound etc was after reading AY I was curious if Kriya was a different tecnique to Knowledge from Maharaji.

The 1st Kriya is infact different in the way that one visualises or feels the 2 currents in the spine etc.

I started meditating when I was 20 years old although I remember having the experience of the Thumbs when I was around 7-8 and also when I used to pee i used to make the energy tingle up my spine by doing the contration mudra,

I recieved the Knowledge from Guru maharaji when i was 22
On my initiation I saw the inner moon and the thousand lighted sun and also heard inner sounds.

The knowledge tecniques always worked for me and still do infact. probably one of the strongest things i felt was afetr a particularly Blissfull mediation I opened my eyes and the walls were melting in light.

I remember afetr going to sleep one night the next thing i recalled was I felt like I sat bolt upright in bed and I was hearing what seemed like aa thousand angels all holding the same musical note lwith the ahhhhhhhh sound and all I could see was golden and white light brighter than anything I could have imagined,I honestly thought id died angone to heaven.

Comparing K to Kriya i would say that Kriya is stronger in the sense of feeling a strong vibration of energy in the crown after the 1st couple of Kriyas and it also seems to bring on the breathless state more quickly but I dont know wether my previous practice helps this you see.
I still practice Kriya also Knowledge and also self enquiry as spoken about by Ramana Maharshi.I have also played around with a great number of tecniques like so Ham breath watching
mantras ala TM and a few other lesser practices.
I honestly think that anything will work now because once you have a notion of your SELF then you can never loose it its just that sometimes the mind likes to play around with stuff etc etc.

Re the star. What I tend to see is what I call the doghnut which looks like a ring of light with soft edges and inside is the star.I think Ive only been through it a couple of times way back I often feel like im sitting in acave of light is how I can descibe it.

I dont feel kriya is bad in answer to one qusetion.

dawnrays
Registered User
(1/3/04 4:03 pm)
Reply 		Re: Thanks Dawnrays...
Well, it just depends. Up until about two years ago I was pretty regular unless I was having a specific issue (like very active kundalini, illness, recovering from child birth, moving, etc.)

I do have to say that one of the benefits to being near a temple or a group is group meditation. I would not knock that even at an srf temple. I used to like the group meditations at San Diego temple. To be honest, by and large I liked most of the devotees, too.

I was not looking for a spiritual path and certainly not a guru when I read the AY. I was familiar with the Cayce writings and the writings of the Great White Brotherhood. I was actually more exposed to spiritual paths after srf. I went to a few Sai Baba meetings and met Amachi a couple of times. To me, the lessons are the most concise and comprehensive spiritual study plan out there.

I am very devotional naturally and a "nurturer". I realize alot of people aren't and find devotion very difficult to understand. My husband is more oriented towards "the light" and actually reads a great deal more than I do. He appreciate the abundant intellectual side of the path more than I do.

Devotion of course, involves love towards all beings. For me, it is also expressed through my love for my family, friends, strangers and for animals and plants. I have been very involved in animal rights issues in the past and have many pets, myself. I also garden in the nice months.

My meditation has been very spotty lately. I would like to do the full meditation twice a day but sometimes it is more like 5 or 6 times a week. I've had alot going on lately though as far as illness and family illnesses. I've also taken breaks for several months to recuperate from things.

needthestar
Registered User
(1/3/04 4:52 pm)
Reply 		More if I may...
Thanks to you both, I have more questions if I may:

Snake:

Does this breathless state that Kriya instigates frighten you?

Do you focus on the Christ Center while performing Kriya?

Do other kriya styles focus on the CC?

Does Kriya overstimulate your Kundalini?

What is a Knowledge technique? Can you elaborate?

Would you please explain "experience of the Thumbs"?

Thanks - I deeply appreciate your effort to share.


Dawnrays:

Did you have trouble with concentration when you first started Kriya?

How essential was Hong Sau to set the groundwork for Kriya?

Do you find your meditations deepen while meditating with others?

Do you do Kriya with your husband, and if so, how does it effect your relationship with him?

I'm very grateful-NTS

Edited by: needthestar at: 1/3/04 4:55 pm
dawnrays
Registered User
(1/3/04 6:00 pm)
Reply 		Re: More if I may...
I liked the hong sau (more than aum).

Kriya does actually helps your concentration. I heard one time of a monk who had such trouble with his concentration, that he was advised to do his kriyas first (normally one does the others first). If you are really having trouble with concentration, the kriya will help and you could even do it first.

Alot of the trouble I'm having with the path right now is the lack of a group meditation. They are WONDERFUL. More so if you know the devottees. I was very close to my Washington DC group and I had great, great group meditations with them. I also had good ones at San Diego (though I wasn't as close to them). The wierd thing with the temples is that, due to the cult nature of srf, the turnover is very high. One poster referred to them as "self cleaning" every three years or so (except for a core few). The group meditations in a smaller group can be group are very, very deep.

I like to meditate with my husband and he usually plays a chant (on a synthesizer). We don't always meditate together, but we try to at night. Actually, when we were both more uptight about(meditation) it used to cause problems. I can remember us doing our EE's together, and start picking each other apart and suddenly, we're fighting! I cannot over emphasize enough having a relaxed attitude towards all of this..

We're alot happier since we've separated the two (srf and the teachings/meditations).

SerenityNow7
Registered User
(1/3/04 9:59 pm)
Reply 		Re: More if I may...
Needthestar, many thanks to you for resurrecting this discussion and getting (and keeping) it back on track. SSSSnake and Dawnrays thanks so much for sharing with us. I anxiously await to know more!

ugizralrite
Registered User
(1/3/04 10:25 pm)
Reply 		Re: More if I may...
I. Kriya made simple.
Kriya can be real simple or it can be a total can of worms. The simple is bottom of spine top of head, breath in and feel energy go up, exhale and feel energy go down. Then as someone said connect the dots. Ask yourself the biggest questions you can conceive and look around for answers. What? You say. For example what is this heart chakra all about? The heart is just a pump, right? How can I learn anything from a pump? So if you are a macho guy there are a lot of things to be learned about the heart, since feelings are not our specialty by nature. So kriya gets you to thinking about your life while your sitting there just breathing up/down. Well that's just introspection you say, what does kriya have to do with that? Probably the intentionality of doing something, anything really to explore the inner self. Kriya is like a department store elevator accessing all floors in sequence.

II. Kriya the can of worms version: go here for starters:


www.pranayama.org/
www.rainbowbody.net/Heart...sutra2.htm
www.amazon.com/gp/reader/...eader-page
www.angelfire.com/biz2/me...akras.html
www.yogajournal.com/practice/219_1.cfm

III. Kriya and Me, your original question.

Ramana Maharshi when asked by Yogananda about bringing enlightenment to the masses, replied that ones soul had to be ripe for enlightenment. Babaji (the mysterious) is said to have detected many such souls in the West. AOY claims that it would take an "ordinary" person 1,000,000 years to attain what kriya can do in one lifetime for the practitioner. So what we have here is kind of a dilemma. Who is drawn to kriya in the first place, ripe souls, or ordinary people? If you're on walrus you're probably pretty ripe, soulwise. All right, I heard that chuckling in the back!

From my earliest memories I have felt a tension in my spiritual eye especially between waking and sleep and it is no different today than then. As a child I had all kinds of fantasies about flying, having two bodies, being able to make myself very tiny, and of being the only real person in the world, everyone else being a figment of my imagination. Though always introspective, I none the less had many playmates and was no angel in terms of my behavior. So was I a yogi in a previous life? I don't know. I don't think I was aware of the spiritual eye again until I started the SRF lessons and first began to meditate.
So you can see that it is a little difficult for me to judge the efficacy of kriya in this life.

One thing of interest is that nearly as long as I have been doing kriya, I have also heated my home with a woodstove. Invariably if there is a fire mulling along in the stove, when I start to do kriya the flames and the draft in the stove will flare up. It has always done that. So there is an anecdote to think about. Kriya is called the fire rite.

About 17 years ago I had opportunity and inclination to do a few long for me, meditations (2 hours perhaps). It was then when I penetrated the center of the spiritual eye (no visions of light were involved) and boundlessness became an experience, something I felt, rather than a concept. It took many more years to become convinced of the reality of my experience, and it is something that I have to intentionally reinforce and live every moment or it simply goes away.

Kriya is, I would say, a gangway or hallway to passing into boundlessness. Kriya translates as "work" it is said. So I guess you could think of it as a mannerism specific to going into spiritual awareness, and no doubt there are many other ways to do it.

SsSsSnake
Registered User
(1/4/04 4:54 am)
Reply 		Re: More if I may...
ok.

The breathless state did frighten me at first but now I welcome it.

While performing the 1st kriya I follow the breath in its circuit.

Shankarandas Kriya which he learnt from Hariharandna goes up in stages and from someone in the know was not how Lahiri and Yukteswar taught it.

Sometimes I have had too much energy in the head but not so bad I felt in danger.

Knowledge is the term that Guru Mahraji uses for the initiation
into the 4 teqniques of meditation and maybe one gets some awakeming of the shakti at the initiation.

The thumbs was what I came across in Da fre Johns book "The Knee of Listening" which was similar to my own experience of like 2 large thumbs pressing on your crown I also used to look at my thumbs as I sat as a youngster I my whoel body would feel expanded and ungrounded.

SsSsSnake
Registered User
(1/4/04 5:04 am)
Reply 		Re: More if I may...


By the year 2001, I had been studying the Teachings of Sri Ramana Maharshi for 27 years,

from age 15 to age 42. I had read around 2000 spiritual books from the various paths, etc.

and I had seen many teachers. Reading those spiritual books, from so many different traditions,

was a waste of time, because only Sri Ramana Maharshi, Sri Muruganar, Sri Sadhu Om

and Sri Nisargadatta Maharaj teach the Direct Path.

Sri Ramana Maharshi had said that self-inquiry is more like feeling than like thought.

Asking ‘Who am I’ is an easy instruction to follow and asking ‘to whom do these thoughts arise?’

is an easy instruction to follow, as long as one stays in the realm of thought.

But when it comes to feeling ‘Who am I’ or feeling ‘I am’, then for me,

that had always been a bit vague, because what exactly is the feeling I am? How do I know I am?

I wondered is ‘I am’ the ‘I-thought’ or is ‘I am’ just my present awareness?

If “I AM” is this present awareness, just the awareness that is now looking at this room,

then paying attention to the I AM is just:



My awareness watching my awareness.



This was like a revelation to me! Instead of having some vague practice where I am told to pay attention to a feeling I AM, without ever being sure what exactly ‘I AM’ means and feels like,

here I had an absolutely clear instruction:



My present awareness watching my present awareness.



Awareness watching awareness.



Not some unknown awareness labeled the Infinite Self.



This awareness, my awareness, here and now watching itself,



while ignoring thought, the body, the world, etc..



So immediately I tried this practice:



Awareness watching awareness while ignoring thought.



I shut my eyes, because the point was also to ignore the world, to turn the attention that normally goes out to the world around 180 degrees and to look inward. However, it also means to ignore thought.

So awareness watching awareness and ignoring thought etc.

If I noticed that some thought had started, I just ignored the thought, and brought the attention back to awareness watching awareness. Awareness paying attention to awareness,

to the exclusion of all else. Awareness paying attention only to itself.



The results were instant! From the very first moment one tries this practice,

one is abiding as awareness! There is no waiting! It is so easy.



I do not mean to imply that from the beginning the ego is dead.

It might take years of continuous practice before the ego is dead,

and thought and the world are gone forever, never to reappear.



However, from the moment one tries this simple, easy to understand practice,

one is abiding as awareness!



My first session of practice lasted around two hours and then I wanted to get some confirmation

to see if there was any support for this practice in the teachings of Sri Ramana?

Had I found something wonderful, the very heart of the practice of Self-inquiry and Self-abidance?

Or was this some detour? So I looked to Sri Ramana’s teachings to see.



I read the book “The Path of Sri Ramana, Part 1” by Sri Sadhu Om cover to cover.

It is amazing that I searched this book first, because the premise of the whole book was the answer

I was looking for. Throughout the book, Sri Sadhu Om focuses on Self-attention, instead of

Self-inquiry. He points this out hundreds of times throughout the book, and this is the main point being made throughout the book. Self-inquiry is really just a way of inducing Self-attention,

and only Self-attention is the true practice.



This Friend practiced the direct method for all those years yet he wasnt aware that I Am was his awareness prescnece till he looked at it from a new angle so if it took him that long it seems its not that good at giving realization and maybe Kriya or another way is just as good.?

With the way the nervous system is stuctured it seems like doing the different tecniques of practice is a bit like spiritual @#%$.

needthestar
Registered User
(1/4/04 7:02 am)
Reply 		Fantastic
Thanks to you both for some great thoughts for this thread. Very concise and on the subject - thanks very much.

SN7 - this really is your thread, thanks for the idea



UG - I loved how your quote from RM, as they tied in nicely with Snake's thoughts.

Please tell me, UG:

Is Kriya the SRF style?

Have you ever practiced other Kriya methods?

Has Kriya ever frightened you?

How does Devotion work with your Kriya practice, or does it?

When you started Kriya, what differences did you notice in yourself?

So you are saying Kriya takes time...that time and effort/concentration is needed for it's success, right?

So these are definite results you are experiencing, and not coincidences as others might suggest? (i.e. the woodstove)



Snake - thanks again for sharing and your patience with my questions: ( I find it incredible that someone at age 15 would pick up on the need for meditation)

Norman Paulson felt like the air was literally sucked out of his lungs when he came to the breathless state. Could you describe your breathlessness the same? Or that you just stop breathing?

Awareness of Awareness seems simple, but I must admit it's a very abstract concept to me. I've tried it abit since your post and cannot quite grasp it.....where Kriya seems a bit more "tangible" to me....the breathing etc.

Does that make sense?

Any suggestions on how one might approach this?


I'm grateful to all that's added to this thread and most of all for keeping the focus. I encourage others to weigh in and share their Kriya experiences - no matter how good, bad, short, long or where and how they learned Kriya - all are needed for a fair evaluation.

Edited by: needthestar at: 1/4/04 7:50 am
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