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SRF Walrus > Life on the Inside > Nuns I wonder about
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Xnun Registered User (7/21/03 6:34 am) Reply	Nuns I wonder about Hi, I left SRF in 2/2001, and until I found this board I didn't know about the mass exodus that followed soon after. Does anyone know names of nuns who have left since 2/2001?
soulcircle Registered User (7/21/03 9:27 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Sister Savitri has left
member108 Registered User (10/21/03 8:49 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about There is a message about it somewhere but I don't believe anyone has compiled a list of names for the Walrus. It makes sense to me. I would not want my name associated with that place any longer. We might as well respect their privacy. Remember that it is drilled into them that they are a failure and will suffer for seven life times! Is that right? Maybe they get 40 virgins? No that can't be. I get my religious manipulation mixed up sometimes. I know they won’t go to heaven but I can’t remember what story the bad ladies tell them. The total monastics who have left is over 30 but that is an old number now. Those leaving SRF employment are even higher if you count those who have been fired (I mean laid off). Reviewing those still there you will find mainly three groups. Those looking for power, those who are clueless and very nearly retarded morally/intellectually and those who are too afraid to leave and make it on their own. If your old friends didn’t fall into one of those categories then they have left. The employees still there pretty much fall into the later two categories. A singular exception is Bro Bhaktananda. He was around when Master was there and still sees the place as Master’s. He is isolated and not involved in the drama. A good man. Unfortunately he is in his late 80’s and will not be with us much longer. Edited by: member108 at: 10/21/03 8:51 pm
xmonk Registered User (10/22/03 5:03 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about xnun, There have been MANY monastics who have left. Of course, a great number left about the time you (we) did. The last count that I was aware of numbered around 40 (+-). I believe it was in 2002 that Savitri left. That one surprised me. She was ma's secretary for many, many years. She finally had enough of the Mother Center shenannigans. Like Dhriti, when she left and sent the message to all the other nuns, Savitri determined "I can no longer grow spiritually in this place." I have no doubt that the awakening will happen to more and more of those overworked, mistreated females in the order, as SRF continues it's downward spiral. Anyway, I wish you all the very best in your new life, and may God wrap His loving arms around you and bless you. Edited by: xmonk at: 10/22/03 5:04 am
crogman1 Registered User (1/4/04 7:32 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Hello? Daya Mata's secretary claims she that SRF is not a place for spiritual growth? Is anyone listening? I would assume she knew the great Mata pretty well. What do you know.
xmonk Registered User (1/4/04 8:59 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Crog, Savitri was such a devoted and spiritual nun. She always di what her heart would direct. So much of what was going on in her association with ma was done as a matter of duty until she could no longer stomach the hypocrisy and downright lying. Her eyes were beginning to open in 1999 and 2000, when that wonderful couple who managed the Encinitas Retreat was treated so terribly. They resigned their posts because of the conditions at that time. They were followed, shortly, by Dhriti and many others, for the way that SRF had been acting. Bni. Bonnie and other nuns, as well as many monks all followed suit. There were about 40 monastics, including myself, that left at that time. Others have followed and continue to follow. Not only has it effected the ranks of the monastics, but others in the lay ranks have left. SRF is panicking, as I write this message, because contributions are drastically down. Workloads are increased on the monastics because of that. Money is very critical. Tsk, tsk. Other than that...things are "peachy keen!"
crogman1 Registered User (1/4/04 7:50 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Yes, I heard the same thing. Yet the leaving seems to have stopped. Why? What are those still there thinking? Are they waiting for a turn around? Do they expect that some wonderful person will step forward and be able to fight through the old lady baloney and take charge? Then what? The organization will become useful? Seriously, why have so many members and monastics stayed there through all this? What do they hope will happen?
xmonk Registered User (1/5/04 7:26 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Crogman wrote: "Seriously, why have so many members and monastics stayed there through all this? What do they hope will happen?" They stay and remain through all the crap that was mentioned, plus much, much more because of two things. FEAR and GUILT. Because they refuse to think for themselves, a condition brought on by all the brainwashing that they went through during Postulancy, and since. They are scared to death that they might "offend" the guru and have to spend lifetimes getting back to being an accepted disciple. They feel guilty because they don't think it is right to have an original thought without Mother Center's approval. The monastics aren't alone in this condition. Many, many lay members (and bliss bunnies) share this thinking. It just isn't kosher to think freely. A classic example of of the results of a cult. Thankfully, there have been those who wrestled their own minds back from organizational thinking and have set themselves free. I wish I could convey to those poor souls the freedom and happiness that would await them if they would only dare to think for themselves and be the persons that they are capable of being.
dawnrays Registered User (1/6/04 10:25 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Fear of the guru? Probably fear of getting a job is more like it. How about fear of having to jump off the srf gravy train for the "fast tracked"and the "special". Alot of monks and nuns just thoroughly enjoy being jerked off by ignorant and adoring bliss bunny "fans". It's alot to give up for a job at Walmart... Maybe they ARE thinking it will turn around and get back to the "good old days." How about the ones that get to have their own temples to torture the members with their tales of "life on the fast track" (the ashram!) Well, xmonk, looks like the "emperor has no clothes!" to use your favorite expression and we are seeing (partially thanks to the Walrus) that some of these people are just a bunch of maladjusted, spiritual ego trippers... Thank God for Master and the lessons, everybody sees through you now!!! Edited by: dawnrays at: 1/8/04 11:20 pm
formermonk Registered User (1/6/04 4:47 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about I couldnt agree more with xmonk. After leaving, along with the 40 or so other monks/nuns a couple of years ago, I realized that SRF perpetuates, in fact seems to encourage, a dangerous attachment known as "spiritual materialism". I would encourage every former monastic, as well as all souls struggling with these issues, to read "Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism" by Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche. He is a Tibetan lama who explains exactly what happens to many who embrace eastern religions. Basically, he says that grasping for self-realization or liberation, which includes putting our hope on an external source, is just another form of materialism that strengthens the ego, rather than seeing through it...leading to a distorted, ego-centered version of reality. He mentions "hope and fear" as being two emotions that feed this view. And this is exactly what is instilled in all members (let alone, monastics) of this organization. It's time to wake up and be honest with yourselves!
SayItIsntSo Registered User (1/6/04 8:44 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Is it at all possible others haven't left because they really believe in their place there, as we must have felt our place? I left Dec 13, 1999. I didn't know others had left, or anything about the situations at MC. I left primarily when I learned that a high ranking brother was sharing private counseling information with a lay person, who was then sharing these people's lives with others. This same person had a hand in displacing devotees from jobs they'd enjoyed and served many years. The entire structure of the temple shifted. This person continued to incorporate themselves within the organization and became very involved with MC matters...many things including Convocation and how it was run. Soon they were having lunch with Daya Mata. I left not only the church but my faith. You see I had introduced this person to SRF. I couldn't reconcile how this person had taken over the temple of my youth; my protective sanctuary, and was now involved in sensitive matters at MC. Spirituality involves trust. I couldn't reconcile how the one constant in my life had gone askew...how it had been violated so easily and permanently by my own foolish hand. Where was my Master now? Walls were tumbling in on me...there were no blessings...no real answers...as if I'd invested all this time...and had to wait for some other world pay off. I had no idea there were other issues or problems within the organization. Four years later I haven't anything new to add. My news is very old. I would like to add that this was my own personal experience. I mean no one unhappiness. Edited by: SayItIsntSo at: 1/6/04 9:20 pm
srfwalrus ezOP (1/6/04 9:12 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Sayit, We are very sorry to hear you had to go through that long trial. This forum was created to air out those problems and hopefully help others from falling into the same trap. Thanks for sharing.
SayItIsntSo Registered User (1/6/04 9:21 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about SRF: I edited that a little from orginal post. It sounded a little spiteful and I don't mean it to be. As you know I was here a long time ago...then left, then drifted back...sort of wistfully wondering about a big chunk of my life.
chuckle chela Registered User (1/7/04 12:14 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about xmonk, with all due respect I think your theory is a bit simplistic. I suspect there are all kinds of reasons why some monastics have chosen to stay. Indeed, I find this absolutist type of thinking reminiscent of the absolutist types of thinking that has gotten SRF into the messes it's in today. That being said, you've definitely nailed a couple of the factors that are probably involved. But it may be that I don't understand you fully. Dawnrays, I think you're being a bit harsh. xmonk isn't as bad as you seem to try to make him out to be. Let's not forget that he's been through some of the same kinds of pain you and others have been through (and perhaps worse). And while I agree that some monastics who are in the public eye (some of the ministers, for example) or have lots of power (the BOD monastics, for example) do indeed get "jerked off" (to use your--ahem--rather creative metaphor) by the members, that certainly isn't the case for the monastics who serve out of the public eye, some of whom appear to have suffered rather significantly. I suspect that very few, if any, of us can appreciate what it's like in the SRF ashrams unless you've been there. Formermonk, while I think Trungpa's materialistic spirituality idea is a valid one and does play out to a significant degree within the SRF culture (as it does in many spiritual cultures), I also think that there are some parts of the SRF culture that are beyond the materialistic traps that Trungpa mentions. There are many people in SRF who are not into the "darshans" (with their implied blessings and fixes), the buying of the stairway to heaven, the praying in public, the endless acts of service, and all the myriad other outward things that one might do in the hope of getting "blessings, "good karma," "darshan," "noticed," "a spiritual zap," the fear and hope, or what have you. I suspect these people don't get noticed . . . simply because they're just doing their spiritual practices and don't need all the material trappings. Does any of this make sense, formermonk? Having said that, I think it's good you've raised the issue, because it certainly needs airing, and it is a significant problem. There are a lot of people who find themselves, wittingly or otherwise, wrapped in fears and outrageous hopes. I'd welcome any more you or xmonk might have to say on the subject. Alas, it's not likely to get much airtime within SRF itself, although, God knows, it needs to be talked about. Just look at the recent posts about fears regarding meditation practice. As Dawnrays implied about another manifestation of the spiritual materialism, some of the monastics love the attention of the members while, at the same time, the members think they're getting the spiritual "goods"; it's a self-perpetuating cycle in a sad dance of delusion. One specific example (of the many that there are) that always downright embarrassed me was when Daya Mata came to Convocation. People would line up for hours, rush to get "good" seats, and generally behave like pubescent teenagers all in the hope of receiving some kind of tremendous blessing just by being in the same room as her. I shudder at some of the memories. We were taught that God was immanent and all-pervading, but you wouldn't have known it by the behavior of those masses. All the Spiritual "Bennies" were up on a stage. And, of course, the leadership sublty encouraged this fawning behavior by keeping the whole thing "secret" until the last possible moment, thus ensuring some sort of frenzied anticipation. At the same time, the official word was that one shouldn't concern oneself about such visits of Daya Ma, and this was one of the reasons they weren't announced. Talk about crazy-making! A very sad spectacle. There are many other examples we could give, and they are common in other spiritual organizations and cultures. There is, however, one other factor I want to mention. As far as I know, it's only been mentioned indirectly in the Walrus before. It is what I'll call the "La-La Land Factor." Most of the weirdness in SRF appears to be centered in L.A., although it is not restricted to L.A.(Trungpa's point was that the weirdness was a Western world phenom). Los Angeles is home to many, many kinds of weirdness, not the least of which are several aspects of the entertainment industry (I wonder, for example, if SRF would have developed that way it has if Yogananda had centered it in Memphis or Boston or Denver or some other such city). I've postulated before on the Walrus that the closer one is, physically and psychically, to Mother Center, the greater the chance of being exposed to all that is weird in SRF. I'm only suggesting a correlation; I have no idea if SRF merely produces this weirdness or whether it may as well attract people who are inclined to go along with it. I mention this factor because I wonder whether some SRF members who are far from the influence of Mother Center may in fact avoid the kinds of traps Trungpa warns about. Just a thought. Regardless, some people (like us on the Walrus) can only take so much of the weirdness and then have to break free to some degree or other. One of the sad things for me (and I can only imagine how painful it must have been for all you former monastics) has been to discover how unwilling the SRF culture has been to examine itself, probably because it has been afraid of finding the things that go bump in the night. SayItIsntSo--great to see you back, and I'm happy things appear to be going better for you. You've posted some great stuff. I remember you mentioning the incident at the temple when you posted here many moons before. I can see how that would have shattered so much you held dear. You wrote: "Spirituality involves trust." That should be in 48 pt type, like this: SPIRITUALITY INVOLVES TRUST! It's something that everyone in a leadership position should have tattooed onto their arms and fried into their brains. While your news is very old, it certainly isn't any different from all the other news that has come out. What you and so many others have gone through just sucks. Glad to hear things are going better.
Xnun Registered User (1/7/04 7:14 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about SayItIsntSo, I would like to send you a private message, but your inbox is disabled. Is there a way to contact you? If you are interested, my inbox is open. Xnun
SayItIsntSo Registered User (1/7/04 9:41 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about I can't seem to get my inbox to work on Ezboard. Is it free? Though I don't know what I can ad more privately. I don't have an email address currently that isn't linked to my business. So, let me work on that. I am going to address somethings I've extrapolated from journals written over the years and post later, though not sure where on this site I should put these observations. Finally, I'm from Southern California, born and raised. There was mention about SRF headquartering in an area known for its weirdness. The question is, why did the all knowing, all seeing Master want SRF located here? Be back later... Edited by: SayItIsntSo at: 1/7/04 10:42 am
etzchaim Registered User (1/7/04 10:13 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about "Finally, I'm from Southern California, born and raised. There was mention about SRF headquartering in an area known for its weirdness. The question is, why did the all knowing, all seeing Master want SRF located here?" I have some thoughts on this. First, I have to say that I don't think that Yogananda was all knowing and all seeing, but neither do I think he was a fake. That said, he came to the US in the 1920's. It might have been that AT THAT TIME there was more receptivity in the more alternative world of Southern California than in other places in the US. Also, I would think that the climate was a factor (it being about 5 degrees farenheit in Ann Arbor today, but at least the sun is shining in between the mini-blizzards we've been getting since Sunday). He liked Mexico - used to go there to get a retreat from work - but that may not have been a very fertile place to start a rather odd and foreign center and wasn't the US, anyway. Other places in the south would have brought him into the Bible Belt and certain hostility. Today we live in a completely different world, but I've run into many people who were surprisingly closed minded about any sort of non-western spiritual practice, even though Yoga the practice of Yoga is widespread in the States.
SayItIsntSo Registered User (1/7/04 10:45 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about Etzchaim, good points. I was being facetious there when I said PY was all knowing...etc. I guess that fell flat.
History Buff 2002 Registered User (1/7/04 11:24 am) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about To Sayitisn'tso, Was your experience in the monks' or nuns' ashram? I gather they are significantly different. And yes, thanks for sharing.
ranger20 Registered User (1/7/04 12:23 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about *Quote:* You see I had introduced this person to SRF. .............................................. I couldn't reconcile how the one constant in my life had gone askew...how it had been violated so easily and permanently by my own foolish hand. You are not responsible for this person's behavior. Would you have introduced the person to SRF if you had known? Did you know at the time? Isn't it possible that if you hadn't given him/her the AY (or whatever) it would have come from someone else? You are not responsible
SayItIsntSo Registered User (1/7/04 4:45 pm) Reply	Re: Nuns I wonder about *Quote:* You are not responsible for this person's behavior. After I wrote that, I realized how silly it sounded. Of course I wasn't responsible. What I find is often times talking of these experiences, even after all this time, I am overwhelmed with emotions. This happened at one of the temples. There were many other things...all stacking on top of my mental state! I'm going to try and post some more information that I think is worthy of discussion, rather than blaming anyone in particular.

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