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Jaded Unregistered User (10/28/01 6:32 pm) Reply	The real question I finally have to post, after lurking about all this time. I saw an earlier message that I thought might get this topic going, but it died out. Too frightening, I believe. SRF is a shambles. "Only love" has become "only us." Even within its own world view, it is a failure. The assumption I see, explicitly and implicitly, is that Yogananda and "his teaching" is fine, it's all the people who have come after who are ruining things. But how do you all know this? If everything about SRF is lousy, why do you think "the teaching" is great? Why doesn't anybody consider the notion that the whole thing is like the Mormons, or scientologists, or any other group. The people who resonate with it get something, but it is all self-generated. Who am I? I've been beating my head against the wall, trying to get something out of the SRF way of meditating for about 30 years. I've talked to just about every minister and been there and done that. 90% of SRF is the same basic Perennial Philosophy that Aldous Huxley talked about. But if you step back for a moment, all you see is the same stuff every other little group does: our founder was the greatest, our group is the greatest, we will take over the world. For those of you who have been on the inside and seen that it stinks, maybe that's all there is. Let it go. Leave it to Blue Cowboy and Concrete and all the others. I think that's why this board has started to peter out. There isn't much more to say. And it may be more than the emperor having no clothes--there may not be an emperor.
KS Unregistered User (10/28/01 8:11 pm) Reply	Had to come up Your question had to come up eventually. Is all of SRF a big lie? I have heard that monastics have suggested that things like this board might make potential SRF members turn away from SRF and therefore might hurt their spiritual search. I say that the impact of the bad ladies is worse. When the leadership, the matas and senior monks included, don’t live the life what do they expect? Do they think that is helping people see that Master’s path and teachings are true? No. The biggest enemy to SRF right now is the leadership. That message is loud and clear on this board. For myself, something about Master and his words does resonate with me. That intangible “truth” thing seems to be there for me. I feel meditation is helping and I am better for having found Master. That said, I am sure I would be farther along if I had never come in contact with the bad ladies at mother center. I believed their lies (my own fault) for too long and didn’t “look to the beam” enough. My contributions here are to try to help others to start doing that sooner so they can make more progress too. As far as contributions slowing down, I think the few dozen people who have contributed here have said their piece. There may not be much more to say. The message is simple to people who find this board. Stay away from mother center and search for God directly or directly through Master.
username Registered User (12/13/03 7:44 am) Reply	Re: The real question Yea, if the teaching were really GREAT everyone who did the teachings would be behaving in a better manner. right? And the organization runnning the show, which is composed of people who have been doing the teachings for a long period of time should be wonderful. And it isn't? So, what is wrong with the teachings? Something has got to be wrong with the teachings. That is the only logical conclusion. I know that we have all been brainwashed that the teachings are the airplane route etc, and we have had some experiences (but are they really spiritual or something else - because aren't spiritual experiences supposed to change you into better people -- and it is clear from this site, that the "spiritual experiences" are NOT changing the monks and nuns into better people) but lets face the logical facts SOMETHING IS REALLY WRONG HERE.
didgeridootoo Registered User (12/15/03 2:14 am) Reply	Re: The real question Here is the real queston. Have you become like the organization that you have left? You complain that in SRF you can't bring up certain issues because they shun you if you do, but here you are shunning those on this board that don't go by your rules--that say things contrary to your own beliefs. You complain that you can't trust SRF, but many of you don't trust each other. You complain of being abused in SRF, but yet you abuse each other.
xmonk Registered User (12/21/03 5:30 pm) Reply	Re: The real question YellowBeard, You say: "People cling to charismatic, intelligent leaders to solve their problems for them. This is far from a new problem for mankind. In the world of spirituality, this is a particularly problematic approach. To find your true "self", you can not follow someone to this "location". Many claim that the guru works as a mirror to reflect the image of their "self" back to them. But in reality, this does not happen. The image of the Self gets reflected onto a spiritual hierarchy, including the fellow who's suppose to be holding the mirror. Are these just ideas that the author here is expressing, or do we see this actually happening as a fact in our life? Finding Truth is just a matter of being calm, still, gentle and highly aware without the clingy search of trying to find what is already in our selves. In this clear, simple sanity of being, our Self will be reflected back unto us off of all things. The image of God is reflected equally in everything. This image is not reflected any more in the guru than in any other common thief." Let me stand and applaud these statements. You are obviously one who has been through the SRF mill and have come out with a sense of reason. You are totally correct in what you have stated, above.
dawnrays Registered User (12/21/03 5:52 pm) Reply	Re: guru issues Actually, I don't consider that I "bash" srf, nor do I see it as "srf bashing" when other people discuss their true and first hand experiences with srf. I don't even consider it "guru bashing" when somebody (and rightfully so) questions the srf conception of him. Much of this is meant to inspire guilt and subservience to srf. Much of the more rational discussion here revolves around separating srf and the teachings, which is difficult for some. Also the cult status of srf. On the other hand, there is some gossip and that not even first hand (since Master has been dead some 50 years.) It is mainly I think for entertainment purposes and doesn't have much to do with real life, day to day issues. Master did not invent kriya and the teachings are, for the most part, eternal. They are thousands of years old and only new to this country. Taking discussions into realms of gossipy speculation on Master's sex life, comparisons with henious crimininals and dictators, takes away from the seriousness of this board. It is a real turn off. I don't know what it takes for you to get upset or stand up for your guru, if you have one. For me, there are certain lines you don't cross. I also find your little accusations and shock at some of my comments, a little disengenuous, to say the least. You seem to be enjoying Yellow Beards offensive ravings to the point of actually jumping on the band wagon with him! If you actually agree with him, fine, but please don't pretend to be shocked when somebody else doesn't "play nice!" Oh! What would Master think! You are a complete phony. I can see through you even through this computer. G'day!
dawnrays Registered User (12/21/03 6:22 pm) Reply	The expert view from Australia G'day again! I guess, living in Australia, you would be even more of an expert on srf issues than, even say, Yellowbeard? Have you ever even been to this country? The srf is mainly clustered around southern California. I am certain you have issues, but what have they to do with srf? Since you have been on this board a whole two days, you really seem to have to low-down on what's going on! So many thanks for clueing us in! Any more great advice? How about a great "pep talk" about how "it isn't so bad!" You would certainly know! What are YOU doing here?
YellowBeard420 Slow Down (12/21/03 10:43 pm) Reply	Re: The expert view from Australia [Thread removed by SRF Walrus Committee to attempt editorial control ] *Quote:* SRFWalrus: Please try and keep the messages here to debates about the topic the main section indicates. The Walrus Committee will allow criticism of The Committee but some of these threads are degenerating into criticism of other sincere people posting messages. Since this is just an anonymous bulletin board you all don’t even know each other. We will be removing threads which are just attacks on the views or personalities of others. This board is intended for the exchange of views and experiences with SRF. Please remember you are free at anytime to create a bulletin board of your own where you would be able to post any message on any subject. Edited by: srfwalrus at: 12/22/03 6:29 am
dawnrays Registered User (12/21/03 11:32 pm) Reply	Cap't Crunch is hoppin mad... Oh please. I wasn't aware that pointing out that somebody who lived in Australia and so might not be an expert on srf headquarters in California, could be considered a "racist remark". Sexual insults? My goodness! Look who's talking. The original "voyeaur" himself. It's just too fun speculating on Yoganandas sex life! I thought I'd just turn it around a few times. It certainly does quiet things down... You are a piece of low life, Cap't Crunch... Your lack of wit and intelligence is only matched by your stupidity.. Debate? It's a joke you even attempt to comment on spiritual issues... Actually you can't, which is why you always bring it around to your own familiar low ground...
didgeridootoo Registered User (12/22/03 7:00 am) Reply	Walrus (This message was left blank) Edited by: didgeridootoo at: 1/2/04 7:25 am
didgeridootoo Registered User (12/22/03 7:10 am) Reply	Re: The expert view from Australia (This message was left blank) Edited by: didgeridootoo at: 1/2/04 7:25 am
didgeridootoo Registered User (12/22/03 9:06 am) Reply	Re: SRF Walrus Community Politics (This message was left blank) Edited by: didgeridootoo at: 1/2/04 7:26 am
redpurusha Registered User (12/22/03 12:02 pm) Reply	Re: The real question A dirty, dust covered mirror reflects an image of much lesser quality and shines less brightly, than that of a recently cleaned mirror. If only the thief would clean himself of his attachment to his body and free himself from slavery to his senses, he would shine brightly and be a light onto himself and also inadvertenly, to others. Yogananda teaches that the Self is the Saviour. He named his teachings Self-realization and Fellowship with Truth (the Self.) Meditation, the golden rule, kriya, and other aspects of the teachings have been around for thousands of years. He did not create them. He did, however, teach them in his own unique way, yet there are universal truths. If you have a problem with either the techniques or the teachings in general, don't blame the messenger. If you mistake your ego with your Self then you are only worshiping an illusion, or at best, a warped version of your true Self. This is very common. Everyone who posts here has different reasons for posting, and each one has his own unique view. Personally I have not been hurt by srf/yogananda nor am I recovering. I really enjoy and appreciate his teachings, his way of explaining religion, and like to discuss him and/or the teachings. If anyone comes along I gladly welcome him/her posting their views, whatever they may be, for discussion and debate, as I did when I was the first to encourage yb to post here, instead on his new ezboard. If someone doesn't like the way Yogananda delivers the message of Self-realization, then don't listen to him (or anyone) and go your own way. The main problem yb has, from what I've read, is not Yogananda in particular, but the master/student hiearchy relationship. It seems that almost everyone here would agree that the goal is to discover your Self or Self-realization. We only disagree on how to go about actually making this a reality. There are three main options a) you follow nobody but yourself b) you follow a false teacher or somone who is blind (not Self-realized) or c) you follow a true guru (or gurus) who is Self-realized. You choose your own way of dispelling darkness -ignorance of the Self. To those who think that clinging to a spiritual teacher is building a cage around oneself -the true cage is your own body, in which your soul, when identified with, is painfully limited to, instead of the boundless territory, joy and freedom found in Spirit.
redpurusha Registered User (12/22/03 1:25 pm) Reply	Re: The real question yb wrote "As a final note on this issue, it's important to be aware that Dianetics (Hubbard's book) and Autobiography of a Yogi are both works with the sole purpose of attracting followers. Autobiography of a Yogi isn't a "real" autobiography just as Dianetic isn't a real self-help book." The Aubiography's sole purpose is to draw people to God, to Self-realization. Dianatics/Scientology sole purpose is to make money (see lisatrust.bogie.nl/scient...ubbard.htm ). Hubbard was a science fiction/fantasy writer, while yogananda wrote about his real experiences with God on his journey to Self-discovery. Edited by: redpurusha at: 12/22/03 1:26 pm
bsjones Registered User (12/22/03 1:39 pm) Reply ezSupporter	Re: The real question Good point red. I'd guess that there isn't one "sole purpose" behind the AoY, and that there is a grain of truth in YB's claim. However, I'd say that there are 3 or 4 grains (maybe more) of truth in redpurusha's claim.
didgeridootoo Registered User (12/22/03 1:59 pm) Reply	/ (This message was left blank) Edited by: didgeridootoo at: 1/2/04 7:27 am
YellowBeard420 Slow Down (12/23/03 4:53 am) Reply	The Walrus Cult SRFWalrus wrote: "The Walrus Committee will allow criticism of The Committee but some of these threads are degenerating into criticism of other sincere people posting messages." YellowBeard shall run with this statement. YellowBeard has been wondering for quite some time about what exactly is going on here. If one were to look into his past postings, they would notice him occasionally saying stuff like, "there's something fishy in this Walrus soup ...". With Dijeridu's insights into how the Walrus Committee and many of the members behave is similar to that of the SRF organization, things have come to a head here. And now I believe that I've finally connected the dots. The Walrus is an on-line cult community. Yes, I know that sounds ridiculous at first. But I'm sure that I'm not the only one that has felt that something is not quite right here. Let's explore this to see if there is any truth in YellowBeard's conclusion here. Let me start off by saying that this is of course a mild, non-aggressive cult, just like SRF itself. The core body of this community is made up of ex-monastics, and Walrus is an ex-monk. And like Ananda, he has broken away from SRF. It's well known in the cult-recovery field that many break-away cult members move on only to start their own cults. Unfortunately this happens in many areas of life where the abused become the abusers. I believe that the Walrus community is a break-away Yogananda cult. All religious cults state that their purpose is to shepherd lost souls unto God, but really they just enslave people within the belief structures of the leader(s). Ex-SRFers find their way here largely on their own, just as SRF does not aggressively recruit. Although some members here have tried to get the Walrus listed on cult-recovery sites, which is interesting considering that this is not a cult-recovery community. It's simply a break-away Yogananda cult. I believe these efforts were recruitment techniques -- subconsciously done or not. Yogananda is viewed as a type of Christ here. And like Christ, people start cults in his name. They say read his teachings, but let us interpret them for you. Isn't that what happens here? People here at the Walrus say that Yogananda's teachings have been corrupted by SRF. You twist his words to serve your own agenda here, just as people do with Christ's words. YellowBeard is not saying that there is some kind of conspiracy here, he believes this process is largely subconsciously taking place. Nearly everything is cult-like here. The Walrus's womanizing and boozing is kept in secret. There's a set of beliefs here that are not suppose to be questioned. When someone comes along like Mystic Traveller, to use a recent example, and they say that they feel SRF is an alright organization and doing Master's work -- she gets lynched with the aim of getting her to except the views here or to chase her off. The beliefs here are violently guarded as they are in all cults. When YellowBeard opened up a discreet thread here in a small often overlooked corner of this board, and mentioned his views on Yogananda, he was immediately lynched wholesale. Without any posting restrictions, at the time, and basically plenty of time on his hands, he could hardly keep up with all the attacks coming in. It was a frenzy, people were coming out of the woodwork. But since YellowBeard does not hold onto beliefs, he simply holds onto what he has seen as truth, he proved unconvertible -- there were no ideas to be converted. And being a feisty bugger, after being chased off, he came back even stronger and took many of the lynchers to task. Since the YellowBeard lynching was not successful, he has had posting caps put on him, and he has had posts deleted that were actually considerably less aggressive than those, such as Dawnrays, that try to continue the lynching process. Can anyone here really say that this activity is any different than what happens in SRF if someone brings up an alternative perspective? I feel sorry for all the people that have come here and have been chased off simply because they hold different beliefs. And I feel ever sorrier for those that have been assimilated into this cult. Many blind eyes glaze over these words, that's why I use to like to call people here Yogananda zombie elves. YellowBeard had no intentions of staying here. He wanted to work out his business then move on. But the tactics here have back-fired. They've given me more stuff to chew on. Actually the "Slow Down" cap makes me want to speak out more, and on more direct issues. Just because you may be able to kick people in the teeth most of the time, doesn't mean you always can. Sometimes you do it to the wrong fellow. Back to this break-away Yogananda cult we call the Walrus. People here aren't interested in democracy. People love fascism when it upholds their particular beliefs. You people would kill for Yogananda -- you won't admit it -- if you felt that the karmic effect would not apply since you're working for a man of God. The Walrus sees the power in this blind, twisted devotion. Just as some abuse people's blind devotion to Jesus and take advantage of that by calling themselves a spokesman for him, the Walrus likes the feel of being an instrument of Yogananda and likes the feel of having a herd. And this herd is twisted and highly aggressive. I think the view of SRF about this community is accurate -- they feel this community is filled with people that are emotionally disturbed. On the SRFWalrus webpage we see: "Should we stay involved or just develop a personal relationship with Yogananda that does not involve SRF? How can we see the problems and still remain loyal and serve?" The words in question here being "loyal and serve". What was Yogananda's mission that we are being loyal to? It was to twist any and all religious teachings to show how they are really secretly promoting Kriya Yoga. All these wonderful different paths were bent by the gravitational force of his megalomania unto himself. The Bible, the Gita, the Rubaiyat, you name it -- if he could twist the meaning within, he did. What was he saying when he did this? All paths lead to me for I am the shepherd to lead you to God. Human history has shown that this always leads to destruction. The most famous person to say this was Jesus. He did say some good things no doubt, but he fell into megalomania and started to say that he was the "one true way". What happened because of this? The most massive scale of killing and torture the world has ever seen. Christians have killed and tortured more people on this earth than any other group, religious or otherwise. What happens when you follow a lesser version of Jesus? Your spiritual destruction. He's taking the Divine which is in all things and trying to snatch it up for himself. And us mere humans have to grovel before him for it, twisting our minds into subservience through Kriya Yoga and all the rest of his mind control techniques. If Yogananda told you to claw out your eyes, you'd do it. Your independent thought is totally shattered. You can't even make out what I'm saying. All you can see is "Yogananda is a messenger of God sent to help me". Wake the heck up! But you can't, can you? Many people here have been doing Kriya for 30 years and have nothing to show for it other than shattered lives. Your minds have been so dulled through this mind numbing practice that you'll continue to your grave. It would have been easier to just believe in Jesus, then you could pretend that you'll go to Heaven when you die because of your faith. But no, you liked the sound of Yogananda. Now you have to destroy your mind all the way to your grave to get to your little fantasy world in the sky. You can't hear this at all can you? You must at least feel dullness. The feeling like being a piece of wood. You should at least recognize that something is wrong because of that. Heaven forbid it be the result of your search for the Divine outside yourself. You say Yogananda teaches us how to dive within to receive the pearls of Enlightenment inside. Have you ever found anything other than mind numbing madness? The problem is that he uses the idea of Self-realization as a carrot to lure you in. What he is really offering is Yogananda-realization. He is the One. His line of guru's are super-duper, and if you send him your women, your property and your money -- you too can become part of this wonderful Divine family. Why did James J. Lynn (Rajarsi Janakananda) get so much attention from Yogananda? There's even a whole book devoted to him by SRF. He was his richest supporter at the time, so he worked him over good. We've seen how the Mata sisters do this, well they've learned from "Master"! Who do you think taught them their tricks? You know you've been conned, you just can't admit it. You've invested your life into it, and even though you have nothing but pounding madness in your head to show for it, you can't face this sad truth. I know you just wanna roll over and die believing that you're going to Yogananda World in the sky. You need to wake up, this insanity has gone on long enough. Hear that ringing noise in the distance? It's your wake up call.
nagchampa2 Registered User (12/23/03 5:52 am) Reply	Re: The Walrus Cult (This message was left blank) Edited by: nagchampa2 at: 12/23/03 7:36 am
etzchaim Registered User (12/23/03 6:43 am) Reply	The Walrus Cult Talking Blues As I was the person who mentioned Yoganandas Moon in Leo, I do have to say that you, Nagchampa have a right to your opinion, but really, I'm a triple Leo. I know astrology. I practice it. It represents the full spectrum of humanity as well as the rest of life. It's symbolism. There is more diversity that you can currently encompass in your consciousness going on in Life. Leo's, like you, express a particular part of Life. If you don't like that, and you want the world to be like your preferences, which, being Vedantist, are very conservative, that is really your issue. Tantrists are more open, and the two systems are opposed to each other. I like the diversity of life and I do not have an issue with the use of powers per se. I don't think it's a good idea to display them, but doing so does not make the person a fraud. Wanting money to run an organization that is part of an assignment that your Guru, and your Guru's Guru's Guru's, the head of the lineage specifically instructed you with, does not make you a fraud. America is different from India, you need money in both places. Having money issues myself, I'm perhaps a bit lax on the ol' judgmental trip towards Yogananda needing money. It's nice that you are concerned with Rajasi's feelings, but that was actually between him and Yogananda. Not knowing a mantra, in my book, would not make someone a fraud, and it would have been Sri Yukteshwar who would have ordained Yogananda, but I really don't care too much, because titles are meaningless to me. There are different systems and it may actually be that some use whatever this Sadhu mantra is and some don't. I personally have no idea was it is. I know what a Guru mantra is, I know was an Ishta mantra is, I know specific mantras by name, but if Yogananda didn't know this mantra, it certainly hasn't affected my lineage. If that makes Yogananda a fraud in your book, that's fine, but please don't insist that people who don't agree with you are necessarily in a cult. That's insulting. We could indeed all be wrong. I have no issue with that, but seeing a cult under every bed is a bit too far fetched for me. Perhaps I'm just limited. Walrus a cult, too? Mabe people JUST DISAGREE WITH YOU! It happens. That's a sign that they are thinking for themselves, unless that's also cultish... I could be wrong. You sound more paranoid than anything. I'm not one to say that Yogananda didn't have issues, but really, just move on if you have found something you prefer and that seems more correct to you. It's your enlightenment. Etz, Queen Leo, thinks the Lila is alright, wishes people weren't so uptight, says, 'see what's in the Center, forget about the Left and Right'. That's where God is. That's where God is. That's where God is. Edited by: etzchaim at: 12/23/03 6:52 am
dawnrays Registered User (12/23/03 6:54 am) Reply	Digeroo, Nagchampa and Chela2020, please stand up.... Resurface Nagchampa? Cherio and Ooroo Why do you bother to make such a spectacle about "leaving the board" ? You never really leave. At least soul circle has finally admitted to posting under two handles (he and rachel corrie). It really helps when you are trying to support your own arguments. Goodness! You are so desperate at this point to see Yogananda bashed that you are putting out the word that Mother Center only sue's if you talk about the members, not Yoganda? How are things in Australia, by the way dig? Gracious, that was a quick jump from down under all the way the mother center, you sound like a real insider. Only a few days on the board and you sound as sour as Nag Champa (I mean Chele2020), it get's so confusing. Why don't you just go back to Chela2020 again, and try to resolve some of your issues. Or maybe even Nagchampa, since you both seem to be in the Vedic society anyway (another amazing coincidence?) You really are one to complain about the Walrus. I've already complained about people posting under more than one handle. How about "leaving the board" and then returning under another one? I think this is the real issue that needs addressing.
didgeridootoo Registered User (12/23/03 7:18 am) Reply	New SRF Message Board I have been gone for a while to come back and see that Walrus has slowed down but there is a new board called Cult Busters, SRF Division which takes in more criticizm of Yogananda. Why is this? Edited by: didgeridootoo at: 3/1/04 11:47 am

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