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A voice in the supermarket Registered User (1/31/04 9:45 am) Reply	Re: Things Lahiri said Hello Sssnake, DON'T EXPECT RESULTS (AND YOU MAY GET THEM), LAHIRI REPEATS *Quote:* "One who practices kriya sincerely, has to transcend the expectations of results from doing kriya " - Lahiri Mahasaya You ask: "Lahiri said that?The Hong Saw technique of contemplation is for attaining the calmness of very calm breathing. The kriya calm is a highest secret [cf. p. 14]." Yes, he said that. The book reference is given at the bottom of the page there. ONE MORE HIGHEST SECRET As for a highest secret - some assume there is only one highest secret - the highest secret. A poet may often do away with customary grammar to serve a fine point. It's like poetic licence or poetic skill: Most of the time we make do with custumary grammar. At times not - for example to point at something subtle. Now, the "cf. p. 14" in your quotation above means I have rendered a bit. Actually, Lahiri Baba wrote/said "the highest secret". But as far as I recall he also says that for other things, and this one "highest secret" involves a series of secrets (in the process of awakening), so I thought a hint like this would be fit. Finally, this presumes that the Indian swami who translated Lahiri's works into English, made no error here. And Hong Saw is for getting calm too. Kind regards, Voice Edited by: A voice in the supermarket at: 2/1/04 5:44 am
etzchaim Registered User (1/31/04 7:40 pm) Reply	'tis a very thick cloak Carl Jung, from The Relations Between the Ego and the Unconscious, Chapter II, “Phenomena Resulting from the Assimilation of the Unconscious”: “Adler has employed the term “godlikeness” to characterize certain basic features of neurotic power psychology. If I likewise borrow the same term from Faust, I use it here more in the sense of that well-known passage where Mephisto writes “Eritis sicut Deus, scientes bonum et malum” in the student’s album, and makes the following aside: ’Just follow the old advice And my cousin the snake. There’ll come a time when our godlikeness Will make you quiver and quake.’ (Faust, Part I, 3rd scene in Faust’s study.) “The godlikeness evidently refers to knowledge, the knowledge of good and evil. The analysis and conscious realization of unconscious contents engender a certain superior tolerance, thanks to which even relatively indigestible portions of one’s unconscious characterology can be accepted. This tolerance may look very wise and superior, but often it is no more than a grand gesture that brings all sorts of consequences in its train. Two spheres have been brought together which before were kept anxiously apart. After considerable resistances have been overcome, the union of opposites is successfully achieved, at least to all appearances. The deeper understanding thus gained, the juxtaposition of what was before separated, and hence the apparent overcoming of the moral conflict, give rise to a feeling of superiority that may well be expressed by the term “godlikeness.” But this same juxtaposition of good and evil can have a very different effect on a different kind of temperament. Not everyone will feel himself a superman, holding in his hands the scales of good and evil. It may also seem as though he were a helpless object caught between hammer and anvil; not in the least Hercules at the parting of the ways, but rather a rudderless ship buffeted between Schylla and Charybdis. For without knowing it, he is caught up in perhaps the greatest and most ancient of human conflicts, experiencing the throes of eternal principles in collision. Well might he feel himself like Prometheus chained to the Caucasus, or as one crucified. This would be the “godlikeness” in suffering. Godlikeness is certainly not a scientific concept, although it aptly characterizes the psychological state in question. Nor do I imagine that every reader will immediately grasp the peculiar state of mind implied by “godlikeness.” The term belongs too exclusively to the sphere of belles-lettres. So I should probably be better advised to give a more circumspect description of this state. The insight and understanding, then, gained by the analysand usually reveal much to him that was before unconscious. He naturally applies this knowledge to his environment; in consequence he sees, or thinks he sees, many things that before were invisible. Since his knowledge was helpful to him, he readily assumes that it would be useful also to others. In this way he is liable to become arrogant; it may be well meant, but it is nonetheless annoying to other people. He feels as though he possesses a key that opens many, perhaps even all doors....”
soulcircle Registered User (2/1/04 5:07 am) Reply	hidden: the keyword, in all its most essensial elements Hi Guests and All, *Quote:* Renunciate moralities have neither eliminated nor diminished self-interest, but have often made its expression more hidden and thus corruptible. In this thread, on Jan.28th Borg108, a respected and admired individual, a former monk, having sought solid hard evidence [PY's behavior] found none--- the nearest to it [eye witness] was given. Not mentioning that a young woman asked to be given a ride immediately away from Yogananda's gauze covered nude females in their private initiations--- Borg108 addressed young women going in and out of his suite at all hours, as explained by Sister Daya as the round the clock dictation. Well, many have not taken the long look-- at the state of art [perfected over 3000 years] that renunciation has reached and how sexual behavior, is hidden in the ultimate sense, and by definition can forever be denied because another way to conceive of hidde--- in the present context, is "never to be proven, or conducted with heavy emphasis on never being caught and if caught, denying it forever!" In Not in the Mainstream In Sex and Spirituality Feb. 1st there is further treatment of this In that the paragraph that this short quote comes from is given In that the whole chapter of Kramer is hyperlinked that this comes from. *Quote:* Renunciate moralities have neither eliminated nor diminished self-interest, but have often made its expression more hidden and thus corruptible. soulcircle/rachelcorrie
chela2020 Slow Down (2/1/04 5:09 am) Reply	Energization Exercizes Creation From "Kriya-Finding the True Path": "Approximately one year before the establishing of the school, a certain book fell into the hands of Yogananda. The book was on physiology by a German by the name of MIller. "Yogananda became very excited reading the book which discussed how to build muscles through the concentration of the mind. "Finding me in front, he told me, 'I have just what I was looking for.' That book helped considerably in shaping the Yogoda Techniques." from the book, "Yogandsna Sanga" by Swami Satyananda, p. 133. Didn't Yogananda say that he alone developed the Energization Techniques? Soulcircle, As I was copying from the "Kriya" and "Raja Yoga" book about hypnosis, how you can control others through its use, it dawned on me, how easy it would have been for Yogananda to have sex with his devotees and also have them not come forward. Edited by: chela2020 at: 2/1/04 5:20 am
chela2020 Slow Down (2/1/04 7:50 am) Reply	TOUCH OF THE GURU NEEDED, CHANGING KRIYA CAUSING PROBLEMS KRIYA-FINDING THE TRUE PATH, page 280 "...the learning of any spiritual discipline throgh easily availabe materials, such as, lessons, books, literature, lectures, seminars, and through organizations, is not the righteous way. Learning thrugh these means could never solve the subtle problems of the seeker. In fact, the Guru-Sakti, "the power of the Guru" is not there, because there is no Guru-Sparsa, "tough of the Guru," which is required to ignite or invoke the blessings of the Guru. The inner Realization of the ultimate Self is beyond the scope of comprehension even by the sharp and subtle intellect of the seeker. The negative forces find an easy time to target and to tempt the residents of the hermitage and the people involved in the spiritual organization arund the teachng of spiritual disciplines through their traditional weapons, such as name and fame, post and positions, the use of the occult powers to attract more people as followers, and the development of bigger organizations in the name of God's works. In fact the style of the negative forces to attack the seeker is very sophisticated and subtle. Sometimes they camouflage themselves to the seeker in the name of positive forces; for example, the seeker may think, "I shall be the honest seeker of trtuh, I will love God, with all my heart and serve God, I will be the honest servant of God, I iwll be the humble servant of God, I will be the best teacher, etc." The seeker is not aware of what is happening here. He or she thinks these are positive thoughts and that he or she is in the right direction; but the seeker is not aware that he or she is individualizing himself or herself, and is looking forward to his or her own enrichment and development or progress. In doing so, the seekers are developing a strong and subtle ego and a stron base to maintain the state of dualism, instead of dissolving the ego or the individual self to merge in Oneness with the ultimate Self to achieve eternal Tranquility, or Sthirattva. Achieving Sthirattva is the ultimate aim of Kriya, as well as of many spiritual disiciples that are aimeda t providing permanent Peace through liberation from attachment and dualism." The Kriya book is packed full of information on Kriya, History of SRF, and shakeups in SRF when Yogananda was alive. If anyone wants to know more about these matters, I would suggest buying the book. I don't want to quote everything Swami Satyeswaranada has said. The first half of the book also deals lengthly with Kriya Yoga, which any Kriya Yogi or Yogini would more than likely be interested in reading. He also talks about how "The Autobiography of a Yogi "was written by four professionals, how it was then spiritualized, and proof that Yogananda lied about how he met Sri Yukteswar. He also goes into the dangers of the changes that Yogananda made to the Kriya techniques, how it can have negative effects on a person, including physical health problems, and this is just to mention a few things that are in this book. The book is also very well documented. Edited by: chela2020 at: 2/1/04 11:34 am
A voice in the supermarket Registered User (2/1/04 8:03 am) Reply	Re: 'tis a very thick cloak - For Jung Lovers Jung lovers, Available text(s) - Yes! Thank you for the Jung posting, Etzchaim. A FIRST JUNGIAN GRIP 1. It is good to know a thing or two about Carl Jung if we want to tackle or get to grips with his thinking. In this forum I think the following book sets many Jungian phenomena (things) into perspective and lets us in on many interesting topics: J.J. Clarke: Jung and Eastern Thought. Routledge. London, 1994. I have scanned it, and in this country (Norway) private downloads may not be illegal. (Hint, hint for those who read much) 2. The Jung Lexicon Anybody that is interested in Jungian psychology can profit from Daryl Sharp's Jung Lexicon (online in three parts) www.psychceu.com/Jung/sharplexicon.html . 3. JUNGIAN BOOKS I HAVE AS SCANNED (NOT PROOFREAD) FILES There are some well respected Jung books I have scanned, but hardly proofread. If legal, I may send at least some of them on request as downloads for some weeks or so (up to three months): 1. Anthony Stevens: Jung. Oxford UP, Oxford, 1994 2. The Essential Jung - Selected and introduced by Anthony Storr. Princeton UP. Princeton, New Jersey, 1983 3. J.J. Clarke: In search of Jung: Historical and philosophical enquiries. Routledge, London, 1992 4. Edmund D. Cohen: C. G. Jung and the Scientific Attitude. Philosophical Library. New York, 1975 5. Brooke, Roger: Jung and Phenomenology. Routledge. London, 1991. 6. R.F.C. Hull, tr.: Psychology and Education: C. G. Jung. Paperback editon. Bollingen Series. Princeton University. Princeton. 1969. 7. Jung, Carl Gustav: Dreams. Translated by by R. F. C. Hull. Bollingen / Princeton University Press. Princeton, New Jersey, 1974. At present I am unsure about possible legal prohibitions in other countries. Perhaps someone will enlighten me on it. Private downloadings are not a problem in this country (in Scandinavia). So in case of interest - if it is legal I may send scanned Jungian texts for a little while (!) ------------------------------- ABOUT J.J. Clarke: JUNG AND EASTERN THOUGHT. Routledge. London, 1994. In Jung and Eastern Thought J.J. Clarke seeks to uncover the seriousness and relevance of Jung's dialogue with the philosophical ideas of the East, arising from the various forms of Buddhism, from Chinese Taoism, and from Indian Yoga. Through his commentaries on such books as the I Ching and The Tibetan Book of the Dead, and various essays on Zen, Eastern meditation, and the symbolism of the mandala, Jung attempted to build a bridge of understanding between Western psychology and the practices and beliefs of Asian religions, and thereby to relate traditional Eastern thought to contemporary Western concerns. This book offers a critical examination of this remarkable piece of intellectual bridge-building: first, by assessing its role in the development of Jung's own thinking on the human psyche; secondly, by discussing its relationship to the wider dialogue between East and West; and, thirdly, by examining it in the light of urgent contemporary concerns and debates about inter-cultural understanding. ------------------------------ JUNG'S INFLUENCES - FROM THE BOOK (EXAMPLE) During his early formative years a man of such wide-ranging intellectual sympathies as Jung could hardly fail to have been affected by the great surge of interest in Oriental ideas which swept over Europe in the final decades of the nineteenth century. Not only were there great advances in scholarship which bore fruit in such enterprises as Rhys Davids' Pali Text Society and Max MUller's Sacred Books of the East series, as well as in the writings of indologists such as Oldenberg and Deussen, but Eastern thought in general, and Buddhism most especially, had begun to enter deeply into the consciousness of educated Europeans and Americans. Jung was clearly familiar with Edwin Arnold's popular Buddhist poem, The Light of Asia (first published in 1879), and though he was critical of the Theosophical Society, he was certainly aware of its great influence and its significance for European culture at the turn of the century. This was a time which has often been seen as one of spiritual revival, a period of spiritual renaissance reacting against scientific rationalism, positivism, and materialism, a revival which manifested itself in a growing interest in the world of the spirit, in the occult, and in Eastern mysticism. H. Stuart-Hughes in his study of European consciousness at the turn of the century has wriaen of the reaction against the 'self-satisfed cult of material progress found at that time', and the powerful surge in favour of the irrational, the non-logical, the uncivilised, and the inexplicable both at the academic and at the popular level (1979: 35; see also Hardy, 1587: Ch. 15). It is in this context that we must try to understand Jung's developing interest and involvement in the East. Though, as I shall argue, his work in this field has many unique and original features, it was not something idiosyncratic and bizarre, as some critics have tried to suggest, but rather was part of an identifiable phase in European culture. Though he undoubtedly played a seminal role in the propagation of Oriental enthusiasms in the twentieth century, his work must also be seen in the context of a much wider historical development, one that has not always been fully recognised and documented. Brief references to Oriental ideas appear in the so-called Zofingia lectures of his student days, and here we can discern clear anticipations of many of the themes of his mature thought. But by the time he came to write his two early major works, Symbols of Transformation (CW5; 1912) and Psychological Types (CW6; 1921), he had acquired an extensive knowledge of Vedic, Buddhist, and Taoist ideas and mythology which he treated on a par, and closely interwove, with symbolic material from Western sources. The bibliography to Symbols of Transformation indicates extensive reading in primary as well as secondary texts: he showed familiarity with the I Ching, the Rig Veda, the Ramayana, and the Bhagavad Gita, as well as with the writings of leading indologists such as F. Max Muller, H. Oldenberg, and Paul Deussen. Here the hermeneutical approach, with its engagement with a variety of cultural forms in dialogue, is deployed to great effect, and we see for the first time Jung's willingness to draw systematic parallels between Eastern and Western symbols. (All emphasises added by me - Voice) ------------------------------ "Ask and it shall be given - perhaps" Edited by: A voice in the supermarket at: 2/1/04 8:11 am
redpurusha Registered User (2/2/04 10:26 am) Reply	Re: Energization Exercizes Creation Stretching & Tensing 101 chela, I don't know about Yogananda developing the energization excersizes himself, but I have my own. I got up this morning, more like rudely awakened by the gradually louder and louder buzzing of the alarm clock, then to get some life into me just began stretching and tensing my muscles in every direction. In about half a minute of this, cracking my neck from side to side, and tensing my entire body I was able to energize my body enough to get out of bed and start the day. I do this infrequently throughout the day, especially while I'm sitting at my computer at work. Even Homer from the Simpsons shows America how it's done. Actually, Kamala, a close disciple of Yogananda, in her book, writes that he got the idea from observing a cat stretching out his body. He then experimented until he found a system that worked or was to his liking. Edited by: redpurusha at: 6/4/05 3:37 pm
ranger20 Registered User (2/2/04 12:43 pm) Reply	Re: TOUCH OF THE GURU NEEDED, CHANGING KRIYA CAUSING PROBLEM chela, I may have missed it in this humongous thread, but who is/was Swami Satyeswaranada? If the AY was written byt "four professionals," that would be real inner circle knowledge, and I have not hear of him before. This is a half curiosity, half devil's advocate question. Point me back to the location if you've already answered this.
chuckle chela Registered User (2/2/04 4:12 pm) Reply	Yogananda's and Vivekananda's writings Chela2020, you've mentioned that you feel Yogananda virtually copied passages of Swami Vivekananda's writings. Can you post any samples to show such plagiarism? This would be one, concrete way in which one could demonstrate a sort of fraudulent action on Yogananda's part. What would be great is if you (or anyone else) could post a passage of Vivekananda's and then the passage of Yogananda's that is an apparent copy. If that isn't possible, if you could mention the books of Vivekananda's which contain passages which struck you as too similar to Yogananda's; as well, passages of Yogananda's that reminded you of certain parts of Vivekananda's writings would be helpful. Thanks. As well, does anyone know of any specific people who supposedly wrote/helped write/acted as ghostwriter for the Autobiography? Actual names would be nice. I've heard several versions of "someone else wrote the Autobiography." Having actual names would be one way of starting to determine if there's any truth to such claims--to be followed up, of course, by having those people (assuming they or their heirs are still with us) come forth with proof or documentary evidence. Thanks.
chela2020 Slow Down (2/2/04 4:29 pm) Reply	Re: Yogananda's and Vivekananda's writings Ranger and Chuckle, First, I will look in the Kriya book and give your more information by tomorrow. Swami Satyeswarananda Giri's guru was Swami Satyananda, who knew Yogananda. So let me show you first what he has to say on the "Auto". As for the S. Vivekananda writings, I read some of his stuff three years ago and noticed that he said things that Yogananda had said, and then one of my friends, who left SRF went to Vedanta and began reading Vivekananda's books said the same thing. After I add some more on the Kriya book, I will start reading S. Vivekananda and see what I can find. I don't think Vedanta minded in the least that he did this, but I never asked. They don't talk about him one way or another, and basically feel that we should not put down other gurus or religions. So I don't ask. I don't even know if that is called "plagiarism, but I do know that Swami Satyeswarananda accused Yogananda of it.
SayItIsntSo Registered User (2/2/04 5:33 pm) Reply	Re: Yogananda's and Vivekananda's writings Yikes! Hugs to all of you who share your opinions. Edited by: SayItIsntSo at: 2/11/04 5:09 pm
ranger20 Registered User (2/2/04 8:06 pm) Reply	Re: Yogananda's and Vivekananda's writings *Quote:* Swami Satyeswarananda Giri's guru was Swami Satyananda, who knew Yogananda. That may bear on one question I asked on the "Changes to the AY thread" - what happened to Swami Satyananda in the AY after PY's passing? He is referenced in the early editions as (1) The swami that Yogananda left in charge at Ranchi when he left for America, and (2) the person who told Yogananda the story of Lahiri initiating a devotee in a dream. All references to him are gone by the time of the 1956 SRF edition.
A voice in the supermarket Registered User (2/3/04 5:25 am) Reply	Re: Yogananda's and Vivekananda's writings Greetings, In one of the old SRF magazines there is an article by a scholar. It contains material that was incorporated in the Autobiography's Chapter 41 - about Alexander in ancient India etc. 1. THE AY: www.crystalclarity.com/yogananda/41.asp 2. THE EAST WEST ARTICLE, "ALEXANDER THE GREAT AND THE HINDUS" by Rao Bhonsle: www.geocities.com/Athens/...ander.html The AY has either taken parts of its stuff from a work that the East West article refers to, or has taken it from the article. If so, it is a retelling (paraphrase), not plagiarism, I would say. Compare as you will. This was the closest I could get. Friendly greetings Edited by: A voice in the supermarket at: 2/3/04 5:41 am
chela2020 Slow Down (2/3/04 5:56 am) Reply	AUTOBIOGRAPY AND THE GITA AUTOBIOGRAPH OF A YOGI “I had never forgotten Sri Yukteswar’s request that I write the life of Lahiri Mahasaya.” Page 466 “ “Autobiography of a Yogi", page 466. Paperback edition 1979.” Thus Yogananda collected materials in 1935-36 to write the life of Lahiri Mahasaya. But what was produced after ten years in 1946 from this data, was his own autobiography… So he proved to have his way again ignoring Sriyukteswar’s request. However, he did include a chapter on Lahiri Mahasay… Now, it seems that many additions, alterations, and changes were made in the process of writing the book. Ideas were interjected to look as if some divine hands were working behind the scenes. Mystifications were well thought out during the ten long year period of editing the 49 chapters from the materials Yogananda had collected. It was written with mystic vibrations which would be attractive to Christians. It was told to the author (Satyeswarananda) by someone that four American professional writers were in charge of editing the 49 chapters of “Auto”. Their job was to narrate the stories in a mystifying way as though divine hands were working… “He (Yogananda) wrote clearly. ‘Listen! You know I am good at publicity and people come in my way, but I cannot manage things properly and I cannot write systematically...” It would be appropriate to mention here as an example of mystification the way the Auto relates how Yogananda first me Sriyuktewar… Chapter 10. I Met My Master Sri Yukteswar. “Torn by spiritual anguish, I entered the attic one dawn, resolved to pray until answer was vouchsafed. ‘Merciful Mother of the Universe, teach me Thyself through visions, or through a guru sent by Thee’ The passing hours found my sobbing pleas without response. Suddenly I felt lifted as though bodily to a sphere uncircumscribed. ‘Thy Master cometh today!’ A divine womanly voice came from everywhere and nowhere…page 105. 'Do not grieve for your amulet. It was served its purpose.’ Like a divine mirror, my guru apparently had caught a reflection of my whole life.” Page 106. The very introduction of this statement here by Sriyukteswar about the amulet is to project as if the amulet were the mystic vehicle of the meeting. One the contrary, we have a different report: the meeting was fully arranged through letter correspondence. “’You should go back to Calcutta. Why exclude relatives from your love of humanity?’ His suggestion dismayed me. My family was predicting my return, though I had been unresponsive to many pleas by letter.”…Sir, I am not returning home. But I will follow you anywhere. Please give me your address and your name.” Auto. Page 108-9. Yogananda had admitted that his family had written him several letters. Now we will see what his best friend, Satyananda, knew and wrote of this matter…This quote is from Yogananda Sanga by Swami Satyananda Giri. “Here in Calcutta the father of Mukunda and his relatives because upset. At that time Mukunda’s uncle and the father of Pravas Chandra Ghose (Vice-President of Yogoda), Mr. Sarada Prasad Ghosh (disciple of Lahiri Mahasay), an attorney of Serampore, suggested to Mukunda’s father: “Our Priya Babu (family name of Sriyukteswar) of Serampore is a discijple of our Gurudev, Lahiri Mahasay. He has become sanyasin (Swami) and recently is visiting Benares. He is a very rational man. We can write to him to convince Mukunda (to return to his studies) and to bring him back home. So, in accordance with this proposal, a letter was written to him (Sriyukteswar in Benares) and also to Mukunda: ‘You will meet a yogi’… “Accordingly, Swami Sriyukteswar Giri Maharaj (Priya Babu) sent a message to Mukunda at Bharat Dharma Maha Mandal in Benares, Mukunda, too, felt attraction in his mind and set out to meet Swamiji.” …the editors want to promote the devotional and mystical aspect so that a large number of Christian seekers would be drawn to God through devotional Yogananda. In this respect, the editors created a work which uplifted the Christian world. Unfortunately, at the same time, due to these mystifications added by the copy editors, Yogananda’s book generated almost the character of a spiritual fiction from the standpoint of conservative, serious, seekers of truth of Vedic culture. For example, one day, a devotee of Sri Ramakrishna Mission, a personal friend of the author said, “I opened the title, Yogikathamrit (the Bengali version of the Autobiography of a Yogi, translated by Indra Narayan Seth, a Kriyaban, lawyer and writer) and I could not continue to read it even a few pages. “The book appeared to me as if it was a book of demonstration or application of asta sidhai (eightfold power of Yoga). As I understand, the utilization and exhibition of asta sidhai are hindrances to realizing the Lord. At least, that is what I understand reading our sacred book Sri Ramakrishna Kathamrit by Sri Mahendra Nath Gupta (Master Mahasay), disciple of Paramhansa Sri Ramakrishna.” THE BHAGAVAD GITA Sriyukteswar had published only nine chapters out of the eighteen of his Gita interpretations of the first edition. In the early 30’s when Satyananda approached Sriyukteswar to permit him to reproduce his Gita interpretations, he gladly gave his permission to Satyananda. Sriyukeswar told Satyananda, “Somehow, in those days in my interpreting the Bhagavad Gita some ambiguities remained; those needed to be straightened before reprint.” In this regard, a little work had been started but was stopped. Then, Satyananda found the drafts of the remaining nine chapters, and published them in the second edition in 1948. Once Satyananda told the author, “Yoganadna wanted to have the copyright of Sriyukteswar’s Gita. I wanted to give it to him, but the people around me stopped me from doing so.” When Yogananda could not get the copyright he made a special effort to complete his own Gita interpretations. Yogananda started his Gita interpretations in 1932. Gradually he published them in his magazine, East-West from June 1932. Hew as able to publish up to chapter 5, verse 13, when he left his body March 7, 1952. The rest were published by his organization gradually in their Self-Realization Magazine. It was completed by the fall issue of 1975. It is interesting to note that Sriyukteswar referred to the Yoga Sutras of Patanjali when he was interpreting the Bhagavad Gita, especially in those verses of the first chapter where the historical names of the generals of the war are mentioned. Yogananda then copied the main points of Sriyukteswar’s presentation including Sriyukteswar’s references to the Yoga Sutras of Pantanjali. What was added was the aspect of devotion. Unfortunately, Yogananda somehow forgot to mention Sriyukeswar’s name even though much of his writing is but a verbatim translation of Sriyuktesward’s original. Strictly speaking, it could be said that Yogananda had just made a plagiarism of Sriyukteswar’s work. Sriyuktewar had elaborate explanations for the first nine chapters which he published…In the last nine chapters, Sriyukteswar bypassed all the features of the previous format and simply rendered in brief the spiritual comments in Bengali…It is found that Yogananda, too, has elaborate explanations in the beginning chapters, and, then brief writing for the rest. Perhaps, he had no materials to consult or he had no time since he was involved in the organizations.” (All above taken from Kriya, Finding the True Path, by Swami Satyeswarananda, pages178-185. So far I have read that Swami Satyananda was the 3rd president of Sriyukteswar’s ashram. I also see that he helped found Yogoda Sat Sanga. “Satyananda lived at Ranchi and taught in the school for a year, and then he was asked by Sriyukteswar to join him at Puri (Sri Yuktewar's ashram).” Page 145. Sriyukteswar made him the leader of the East. I will read the book and see what happened to him. He may have just stayed with Sri Yukteswar. Voice: Swami Satyeswarananda didn't accuse Yogananda of plagiarizing the "Auto" but the "Gita." Edited by: chela2020 at: 2/3/04 6:09 am
A voice in the supermarket Registered User (2/3/04 6:12 am) Reply	Re: AUTOBIOGRAPY AND THE GITA Greetings Chela, Your posting on the AY was an eye-opener to me. Thank you for the work of digging up such sides of the book! On the one hand I feel sad because some more of the dreams I had imbibed when I first read the AY, don't seem to stand the clear light of day. On the other hand I feel more liberated. I may carry a little conflict in this. Yes, it is VERY good that you do this painstaking work of copying salient information on the board - THE BHAGAVAD GITA: YOGANANDA COPIED LAHIRI TOO There is one more thing I would like to draw attention to: Forkhand and I noticed separately that Yogananda copied much from LAHIRI MAHASAYA'S commentary on the Bhagavad Gita. All the interpretations of the characters, the correspondences with the cardinal directions of the compass - they are all there. I observed just one difference - one of the Gita characters was given different attributes in Yogananda's work. REFERENCE: Satyeswarananda, swami., translator: Complete Works of Lahiri Mahasay Vol. II: The Bhagavad Gita Interpretations of Lahiri Mahasay. The Sanskrit Classics. San Diego, 1991. Edited by: A voice in the supermarket at: 2/3/04 6:18 am
chela2020 Slow Down (2/3/04 9:04 am) Reply	Re: AUTOBIOGRAPY AND THE GITA Voice, I understand your feeling somewhat sad. I had my ups and downs with the information that I was receiving even years ago, much denial, then finding others who said the same. I had no reactions to the Kriya book outside of realizing that I had this book in my hands about 5 years ago and didn't want to believe it, so through it in the garbage. I almost didn't buy it last week, but here I was at Heaven On Earth bookstore in Encinitas, and it was staring at me in the face, and the $20 was a lot of money to me at the moment since I spent a lot of money that week already, but I bought it in case it could help others, and what I found was more than I ever remembered reading. I feel very liberated now, just as you said you feel. It also took a lot of questioning of gurus from many organizations to realize that anyone can walk away from their guru just from having doubts alone. If you no longer trust your guru, then how can he help you?
ranger20 Registered User (2/3/04 11:53 am) Reply	Re: AUTOBIOGRAPY AND THE GITA *Quote:* It also took a lot of questioning of gurus from many organizations to realize that anyone can walk away from their guru just from having doubts alone. If you no longer trust your guru, then how can he help you? Thanks again for sharing some of those conversations. They really sank in one day while spending quality time with one of my greatest spiritual advisors, my dog. I was pondering obedience training (or lack thereof!). Let's say I took my dog to obedience class and he didn't get along with the trainer. What would I do? Sentence him to extra incarnations, or try another trainer? (Hint: my feelings toward my dog are one of my best temporal images of the feelings of a loving and benevolent God toward me).
nagchampa2 Registered User (2/3/04 12:10 pm) Reply	Re: AUTOBIOGRAPY AND THE GITA Ranger20, I loved your post. You did see that I posted above it the answer to your questions of last night? With this I have to fully agree: "my feelings toward my dog are one of my best temporal images of the feelings of a loving and benevolent God toward me."
nagchampa2 Registered User (2/4/04 4:10 am) Reply	Re: Yogananda's and Vivekananda's writings Chuckle Chela, In regards to copying Swami Vivekananda, any time I have ever seen anything it has always been a sentence or two. I found one the other day in "Raja Yoga" that seemed like an exact quote that Borg had written here earlier, and which I argued against: page 177 in "The Compete Works of Swami Vivekananda, in the "Raja Yoga" section: "Read only those books which have been written by persons who have had realization." I argue that because even Vedanta members read whatever they want, and their libraries are full of books on philosophy, and they sell other books in their stores by those who are not realized or so it appears. This could be idealism, and if a person can do it, fine. If not, there is no judgment. Whereas, in SRF, one was made to feel that you really could not read anything else. I looked over my books by Swami Vivekananda, and I realize that most of what I have read is: "Raja Yoga", "Bhakti Yoga", and "Karma Yoga." It may have been in either of these books where I ran into sayings that Yogananda said that I loved most. Obviously the one I just quoted was not one of them. I have read very few of his lectures, so I don't imagine they are in there. But I am not sure if you can even call this plagiarism, yet he didn't say that Vivekananda said it first, and how do we know if he really had? I need to go back and read those books again anyway, so if I come across a quote, I will let you know. It will take time, and I will post it on this tread.
nagchampa2 Registered User (2/4/04 4:36 am) Reply	Re: TOUCH OF THE GURU NEEDED, CHANGING KRIYA CAUSING PROBLEM Ranger 20 I finished reading "Kriya-Finding the True Path," so I can answer your question as to who Swami Satyeswarananda is. First I want to say that the book is abut 330 pages long, half of it deals with Kriya, the other half history of Yogananda, SRF, and Yss, etc. I was only interested in the latter half. Swami Sat was a disciple of Swami Satyananda, and he now lives in San Diego, unless he has moved since I called his group over 5 years ago. Satyananda was a childhood friend of Yogananda. They were both given Kriya by Bhagavat Charam Ghosh in 1906, then initiated by Kebalananda in 1907, and by Sriyukteswar in 1909. (Note how many gurus they had.) Page 140 From my reading the book Satyananda loved Yogananda unconditionally, and while he disagreed with his Kriya modifications and his use of miracles, he remained his friend until the day he left his body in 1971. He left left Ranchi at one point and went to Sri Yukteswar's group. Then Yogananda talked him into returning, so he did both. Then at one time, Yogananda appointed Swami Binayananda as head at Ranchi. (Swami Binayananda was a student of Satyananda.) "This appointment brought a severe blow to them and resulted in big changes." "In 1941-42, many dedicated Kriya followers were forced to leave including the founder members of YSS and one fot he founding fathers, the founding general secretary of and Principal of and Principal of the school, Swami Satyananda." Out of respect for Yogananda, Satyananda never wrote to tell him what was happening. Later on, Yogananda wrote to him admitting he made a mistake and asked him to return, but he stated that under the present conditions, he could not do so. At this tiime he and others who had left had formed their own hermitage, Sevayatan. Satyananda had also been spending time at Maharsi Ramana's ashram. Years later Daya Mata said to Swami Satyeswarananda, "Please forget about what had happened between Guruji and Satyananda." (pages 140, 145, 158, 160, 162-165, 188, and 242) Those who are interested in the history of SRF and YSS and the problems in those two organizations would be interested in this book. It seems he covers the years up to 1970 or so. For those interested in Kriya, he also goes into some detail of the modifications that Yogananda made to it, and the dangers of doing so and how it just doesn't work for most people. He said spiritually, you just can't change something that has been proven to work. Then he talks about how YSS is run by American swamis and that when you write to them about your practice, they have no real answers. (Sound familiar?) Then he talks about the Guru/disciple relationship, and how you need a guru who is in the body. Also, when Yogananda said that he was the last in line of gurus, he said that "he was trying to respect the original Kriya tradition by indicating that he was the last Guru, or Master, of his line of teachings since he dropped the teaching of Talabya Kriya, or Khecharimudra." page 271 And last of all, on this subject, I have a quote from the book: Talk with Sri Ramana Maharshi: Yogananda: How is the spiritual uplift of the people to be effected? What are the instructions to be given them? Maharshi: They differ according to the temperments of the individuals and according to the spiritual ripeness of their minds. There cannot be any instruction en masse". Edited by: nagchampa2 at: 2/4/04 4:58 am

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